- Jack on Beyond the Lippelt Letter: The Strategic Reality of the First Brazilian Missionaries: “My sense is that there’s a lot of that “behind the scene” work going on all the time–and most of us don’t know the half of it. The spreading of the kingdom is really a product of a continuous outpouring of small miracles–a large portion of which, I’m sure, is an answer to the faith of local converts.” Apr 22, 16:50
- on Rejecting the Restoration in 1654: “Yes, these are all topics that interest me greatly. This stuff starts with Luther who wanted to reject all prophets as schwamer, and as I’ve shouted for a very long time, orthodox Protestants were in no way precursors to the Restoration. As JS said in his very last church, “the old Catholic church is worth more than all” the Protestants. JS had some praise for Methodism and John Wesley, but not the Reformers. This didn’t mean that JS wanted to join the Catholics, but he was correct that Mormonism is closer to Catholicism than Protestantism. And thanks for noting Plato. There is ANOTHER Christian tradition of Christian mysticism that draws heavily on Plato that is much closer to Mormonism. It has roots in early Christianity, but really gets revived by medieval German mystics like Meister Eckhart. Persists into the Reformation especially the Family of Love who have a big influence in 17th century England. Jane Lead noted she was tapping into that network in the autobiography she wrote for her German followers that you translated for me, Jonathan. Thanks again! A number of Lead’s German followers settled in eighteenth-century Pennsylvania: the Society of the Woman in the Wilderness, the Dunkers, and the Ephrata Cloister. The Thirty-Years War left many on the continent hyper interested in what they saw as the coming end times and saw Lead’s visions as a sign of the outpouring prophecy marking that the end was near.” Apr 22, 09:21
- on What Was Revealed to You In Church (Or What Did Church Lead You to Think About Yesterday), 4/19)?: “I really appreciate these posts. I’ve read them for many weeks/months, and left a comment last week for the first time. It has caused me to think more about my weekly worship experience, so thank you for doing this. We had a convert from India speak. He sounded like he had been a member of the Church his whole life. I was so impressed with how he has jumped in with both feet and seems to be loving life in the Church. Before heading to Sunday School, I was speaking with a couple of the YSA out in the hallway. I ended up being invited to attend their YSA class (even though I am an OMA). The few YSA that attended (we are out in the “mission field”) were having a very good discussion. It was good to see, but I still worry about them. I hope they feel supported, and not alone.” Apr 21, 16:39
- on Rejecting the Restoration in 1654: “Well, he probably would have been martyred and his followers driven into exile, maybe even forced to flee to some less-populated part of North America…” Apr 21, 15:11
- on Rejecting the Restoration in 1654: “Thanks for this. Reminds me of a discussion we sometimes have with traditional Christian types about why God waited until the 19th century to restore the Church, and then you think about what Joseph Smith’s fate would have been in 16th century Prague.” Apr 21, 07:25
- on What Was Revealed to You In Church (Or What Did Church Lead You to Think About Yesterday), 4/19)?: “A member of the stake Young Women’s Presidency spoke in sacrament meeting. She started with President Nelson’s quote that “The Lord loves effort” and then talked about the feeding of the 5,000. Her message was that the Lord loves our effort, and he will take our five loaves and two fishes’ worth and make it enough. Which surprised me, because I’d always taken that quote in a more negative sense: “So put forth effort or else!” Now that I drag it out into the light, the “or else” was “Or the Lord won’t love you.” That got me thinking about why my brain would go there, given what I know about the Lord. Clearly that sister had the better understanding.” Apr 20, 22:13
- on What Was Revealed to You In Church (Or What Did Church Lead You to Think About Yesterday), 4/19)?: “While teaching Gospel Doctrine, I realized that every class is the investigator class, at least in my ward. And that’s okay. The newer members and friends of the missionaries had some great insights to share.” Apr 20, 19:43
- on What Was Revealed to You In Church (Or What Did Church Lead You to Think About Yesterday), 4/19)?: “Here are a few of the things I thought about because of attending Church meetings yesterday (4/12): One speaker in Sacrament meeting (an actor) looked at preparing for a performance as a metaphor for practicing faith. I think something is there. We often look at faith as some kind of discrete mental process, and not as a learned, practiced thing similar to training a muscle or learning how to pronounce something. There’s something to be gained from looking at it as practicing faith instead of deciding to somehow be faithful. Later, in Sunday School, someone commented that faith is not Sysiphussian — its not a slog that we have to do over and over again just to stay in the same place. I thought that was a great point. In Sunday School, we read a chapter of the scriptures for the lesson by going person by person, each one reading a verse. Maybe you’ve seen the same thing happen in your classes. I suppose that could be a way to eat up time, or cover for a lack of preparedness — but I think its also a way of involving the whole class in the lesson — you can’t read something and not connect with what it says at least a little. Depending on how its done, I think it can be very effective. Another comment in Sunday School talked about repetition in ordinances. The commentator was a Temple Worker, and said he had done some ordinances hundreds of times. He observed that finding the Lord in the repetition can be surprising and valuable. I agree — repetition can either dull our senses and allow us to tune out, or it can focus us and make us carefully consider the details, if we will focus on it. A reminder: Please focus on what you learned or how you reacted to church, not on your criticism of what was wrong or what someone did that was wrong. This thread isn’t about criticizing, its about realizing the vast amount we can learn by thinking about what happened in Church and listening for what will be revealed to us there.” Apr 20, 12:47
- on The Ordain Women Movement in Retrospect: “Steven C., Kate Kelly was far more strategic than you’re giving her credit for. She understood that movements often require both disruption and diplomacy. She said every movement needs both “Malcolms and Martins” and she knew she was not the Martin. She chose, deliberately, to be the disruptor in order to create urgency, and raise visibility. She knew she was NOT keeping her head safely down. She knew she was not in a fight where she could run away and live to fight another day. That kind of imminent pressure she applied has always been part of how change happens. Accelerants are needed. And, she got results. So did Sam Young. We owe both a debt of gratitude, whether or not the church acknowledges that many of the changes they made were indeed a direct result of their work. For generations, women in the Church have worked patiently and faithfully for change, happy for small policy changes. Frustrated. Hopeful. Much of the progress they have achieved has been lipstick on the pig. Meanwhile, the church is hemorrhaging its Gen Alpha (current primary/YW) daughters as they grapple with the patriarchy in a world where equality is their expectation (realistic or not). Kate didn’t replace or minimize the efforts of strategic long-range LDS feminists. She just served in a different capacity – as the accelerator, the combustion. She was the Malcolm to their Martins. That is not recklessness. It’s intentional, courageous leadership. All sisters in the church should be saying “thank you, Kate Kelly”.” Apr 20, 11:01
- on A Theology of Absence: Rosalynde Welch on the Poetry of the Old Testament: “Congratulations again this week to a couple more T&S alumni, probably the two most skillful writers to have regularly posted here.” Apr 18, 17:58
