The latest big AI breakthrough is AI agents, or AI bots that can do the kind of mundane Googling-and-fill-out-spreadsheet work that interns typically do. Like all AI you have to check it but still, this is in the category of possibly reducing mundanities so that people can focus on more creative work.
I switched back to GPT after apostatizing to Google Gemini for a few months, so I have access to a certain number of these agent requests every month. To test it out, I had it do something I’ve had my list for a while. My prompt:
I want you to go through this list of members of the 12, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_members_of_the_Quorum_of_the_Twelve_Apostles_(LDS_Church), navigate to the Wikipedia page for each member of the quorum of the 12 (past and present), and make a spreadsheet that shows which members of the 12 throughout history were related to other high church leaders.
After the first iteration I added some detail, asking it to add a start and end date, etc.
At the bottom of this post is the actual data. A few things.
- I had it create a chart of % of the Q12 with some relations. I spot-checked a few locations that were born out (the little bumps are from years where you had more than 12 people in the Q12 because of people passing away or being moved around, so the denominators shifted a little), and it passes the smell test, but I didn’t do the complete math, so caveat emptor. That being said, it’s clear what the trend is regardless of the little inaccuracies. Also, with the death of Elder Ballard and the calling of Elder Kearon, for the first time ever the Church has a Q12 where no member is a close relation of any other member, past or present. Once President Eyring passes, assuming his replacement isn’t a close relation of another Church leader, it will be the first time the FP+Q12 has no close family ties to other past Church leaders. (Close family, I’m not counting people who are the umpteenth thousandth descendant of Heber C. Kimball).
- In terms of why, I do think that we are (thankfully) moving away from the spiritual royalty idea in the Church. Also, the Church is so much, much larger there are just more options, so the chance that the person being called happens to be the close relative of another leader is quite a bit smaller.
- It’s not perfect obviously. Specifically, in the first iteration it missed John W. Taylor, and in the latest iteration it missed Henry B. Eyring being the nephew of Spencer W. Kimball and Willard Richard being the cousin of Brigham Young. There may have been others that I’m not aware of.
- It took my request very literally with ending dates. For example, President Monson’s leaving date was set at 1985, the year he was put into the First Presidency, so this was a case when I should have specified Quorum of 12 AND First Presidency.
- The spreadsheet the GPT agent put together after crawling through Wikipedia
| Name | StartYear | EndYear | RelatedTo | Relationship |
| Thomas B. Marsh | 1835 | 1839 | ||
| John F. Boynton | 1835 | 1837 | ||
| Orson Pratt | 1835 | 1881 | Parley P. Pratt | Brother |
| William Smith | 1835 | 1845 | Joseph Smith | Brother |
| Luke Johnson | 1835 | 1837 | Lyman E. Johnson | Brother |
| Parley P. Pratt | 1835 | 1857 | Orson Pratt | Brother |
| Lyman E. Johnson | 1835 | 1837 | Luke Johnson | Brother |
| Orson Hyde | 1835 | 1878 | ||
| Heber C. Kimball | 1835 | 1847 | Orson F. Whitney | Grandfather |
| Brigham Young | 1835 | 1847 | Brigham Young Jr. | Father |
| David W. Patten | 1835 | 1838 | ||
| William E. McLellin | 1835 | 1838 | ||
| John E. Page | 1838 | 1846 | ||
| John Taylor | 1838 | 1880 | John W. Taylor | Father |
| George A. Smith | 1839 | 1868 | Joseph Smith | Cousin |
| Wilford Woodruff | 1839 | 1889 | Abraham O. Woodruff | Father |
| Willard Richards | 1840 | 1847 | ||
| Lyman Wight | 1841 | 1848 | ||
| Amasa Lyman | 1842 | 1867 | Francis M. Lyman | Father |
| Ezra T. Benson | 1846 | 1869 | Ezra Taft Benson | Great-grandfather |
| Erastus Snow | 1849 | 1888 | ||
| Charles C. Rich | 1849 | 1883 | ||
| Lorenzo Snow | 1849 | 1898 | Joseph Smith | Brother-in-law |
| Franklin D. Richards | 1849 | 1899 | George F. Richards | Father |
| George Q. Cannon | 1860 | 1889 | Abraham H. Cannon | Father |
| Joseph F. Smith | 1866 | 1880 | Hyrum M. Smith & Joseph Fielding Smith | Father (two sons) |
| Brigham Young Jr. | 1868 | 1903 | Brigham Young | Son |
| Albert Carrington | 1870 | 1885 | ||
| Moses Thatcher | 1879 | 1896 | ||
| Francis M. Lyman | 1880 | 1916 | Amasa Lyman | Son |
| John Henry Smith | 1880 | 1910 | George A. Smith | Son |
| George Teasdale | 1882 | 1907 | ||
| Heber J. Grant | 1882 | 1918 | Jedidiah Grant | First Presidency, I added this one. |
| John W. Taylor | 1884 | 1905 | John Taylor | Son |
| Marriner W. Merrill | 1889 | 1906 | Joseph F. Merrill | Father |
| Anthon H. Lund | 1889 | 1901 | ||
| Abraham H. Cannon | 1889 | 1896 | George Q. Cannon | Son |
| Abraham O. Woodruff | 1897 | 1904 | Wilford Woodruff | Son |
| Matthias F. Cowley | 1897 | 1905 | Matthew Cowley | Father |
| Rudger Clawson | 1898 | 1943 | ||
| Reed Smoot | 1900 | 1941 | ||
| Hyrum M. Smith | 1901 | 1918 | Joseph F. Smith | Son |
| George Albert Smith | 1903 | 1945 | John Henry Smith | Son |
| Charles W. Penrose | 1904 | 1911 | ||
| George F. Richards | 1906 | 1950 | Franklin D. Richards | Son |
| Orson F. Whitney | 1906 | 1931 | Heber C. Kimball | Grandson |
| David O. McKay | 1906 | 1934 | ||
| Anthony W. Ivins | 1907 | 1921 | ||
| Joseph Fielding Smith | 1910 | 1970 | Joseph F. Smith | Son |
| James E. Talmage | 1911 | 1933 | ||
| Stephen L Richards | 1917 | 1951 | Willard Richards | Grandson |
| Richard R. Lyman | 1918 | 1943 | Francis M. Lyman | Son |
| Melvin J. Ballard | 1919 | 1939 | M. Russell Ballard | Grandfather |
| John A. Widtsoe | 1921 | 1952 | ||
| Joseph F. Merrill | 1931 | 1952 | Marriner W. Merrill | Son |
| Charles A. Callis | 1933 | 1947 | ||
| J. Reuben Clark | 1934 | 1934 | ||
| Alonzo A. Hinckley | 1934 | 1936 | Gordon B. Hinckley | Uncle |
| Albert E. Bowen | 1937 | 1953 | ||
| Sylvester Q. Cannon | 1938 | 1943 | George Q. Cannon | Son |
| Harold B. Lee | 1941 | 1970 | ||
| Spencer W. Kimball | 1943 | 1973 | Heber C. Kimball | Grandson (also cousin to Orson F. Whitney & J. Reuben Clark) |
| Ezra Taft Benson | 1943 | 1985 | Ezra T. Benson | Great-grandson |
| Mark E. Petersen | 1944 | 1984 | ||
| Matthew Cowley | 1945 | 1953 | Matthias F. Cowley | Son |
| Henry D. Moyle | 1947 | 1959 | ||
| Delbert L. Stapley | 1950 | 1978 | ||
| Marion G. Romney | 1951 | 1985 | ||
| LeGrand Richards | 1952 | 1983 | George F. Richards | Son |
| Adam S. Bennion | 1953 | 1958 | ||
| Richard L. Evans | 1953 | 1971 | ||
| George Q. Morris | 1954 | 1962 | ||
| Hugh B. Brown | 1955 | 1970 | ||
| Howard W. Hunter | 1959 | 1989 | ||
| N. Eldon Tanner | 1962 | 1963 | Hugh B. Brown | nephew |
| Thomas S. Monson | 1963 | 1985 | ||
| Boyd K. Packer | 1970 | 2015 | ||
| Marvin J. Ashton | 1971 | 1994 | ||
| Bruce R. McConkie | 1972 | 1985 | Joseph Fielding Smith | son-in-law |
| L. Tom Perry | 1974 | 2015 | ||
| David B. Haight | 1976 | 1996 | ||
| James E. Faust | 1978 | 1995 | ||
| Neal A. Maxwell | 1981 | 2004 | ||
| Russell M. Nelson | 1984 | 2018 | ||
| Dallin H. Oaks | 1984 | |||
| M. Russell Ballard | 1985 | 2023 | Melvin J. Ballard | Grandson |
| Joseph B. Wirthlin | 1986 | 2008 | ||
| Richard G. Scott | 1988 | 2015 | ||
| Jeffrey R. Holland | 1994 | |||
| Robert D. Hales | 1994 | 2017 | ||
| Henry B. Eyring | 1995 | |||
| David A. Bednar | 2004 | |||
| Dieter F. Uchtdorf | 2004 | |||
| Quentin L. Cook | 2007 | |||
| D. Todd Christofferson | 2008 | |||
| Neil L. Andersen | 2009 | |||
| Gary E. Stevenson | 2015 | |||
| Dale G. Renlund | 2015 | |||
| Ronald A. Rasband | 2015 | |||
| Gerrit W. Gong | 2018 | |||
| Ulisses Soares | 2018 | |||
| Patrick Kearon | 2023 |
Comments
9 responses to “AI Agents and Family Relations Among the 12”
Quentin L. Cook is a two time great grandson of Pres. Heber C. Kimball, which would make him a relative by marriage to Pres. Eyring. Pres. James E. Faust is a descendant of Francis M. Lyman and his father Amasa M. Lyman
Sure, but I noted that I’m just dealing with close relations (one or two degrees), since if we get into great-grandchildren then half of Utah qualifies (not a scientific estimate).
Although I’m seeing now that the AI picked up a couple great-grandchildren relations, so I must not have been clear enough in the prompt.
1. GB Hinckley doesn’t seem to be on your list of apostles.
2. JB Wirthlin is the cousin of GB Hinckley, and also the son of JL Wirthlin who was the presiding bishop for the church. Presiding bishop doesn’t count if you’re focused on exclusively apostle relationships, but if the broader idea is to look at high ranking church positions, presiding bishop probably should count, IMO.
3. It feels weird to count someone as ‘related to another apostle’ when that other apostle is a descendent of theirs. Yes, they are obviously related, but it’s not like anyone was walking around thinking, “George F Richards probably only got called as an apostle because he’s LeGrand Richard’s dad.” These reciprocal relationships are not consistently applied in your list; John Taylor is listed as John W Taylor’s father, but Hugh B Brown is not listed as Tanner’s uncle. Additionally, using forward looking relationships means that the results from the past can change in the future. If Richard L Evan’s grandson is the next apostle called, suddenly the percentage of apostles related to another apostle back in the 1950s just went up!
DaveW: All of that is fair.
I don’t get the point of counting grandfathers and uncles, such as Ezra T. Benson and Alonzo Hinckley. When they were called their grandsons and nephews were decades away from being church leaders themselves. The percentage of relatedness for earlier quorums will go down if you don’t count those relationships, and I don’t see a reason for counting them when making a comparison with more recent quorums. Maybe grandsons and nephews of current apostles will seventy years from now will raise the current quorum’s percentage too.
The point isn’t necessarily a nepotistic one, where their GA relative directly called them to that position, but rather that they could have been shortlisted because they belonged to a blue blood family. But yes, by counting it in both directions I’m essentially double counting every tie, that’s fair.
You can look at the apostles called in 1943 two different ways: They were both stake presidents in what were then outlying areas of the Church. They were named Kimball and Benson, though.
The way I look at it is that, sure, some descendants of General Authorities have also been called, but also have many others haven’t. This is especially the case with the likes of polygamist leaders who had dozens of children; Heber C. Kimball had fifty-two sons.
There is something to be said for heritage, though. What I think Boyd K. Packer meant with his term “believing blood” was parental example of having testimonies and being involved in the Church being passed down. I can certainly see patterns of this with my ancestors, but being the third great-grandson of a counselor in the First Presidency (who’s also my namesake) doesn’t entitle me to anything.
For a long time, living in Utah meant a much greater likeness of being called to auxiliary presidencies and boards. Susan Winder Tanner and Susan Buhler Taber (my late mother) are second cousins, but they made their mark in very different ways. This was in large part based on where they spent their adult lives.
There used to be a website called “Grandpa Bill’s General Authorities Site”. This LDS genealogist collected all the direct and indirect familial and other relational connections between generations of general authorities- including 70s. It was an extremely large and hyperlinked web of information. He indexed any and all known connections, supported by a large crowd-source. It’s been taken down, such a pity.
Your methodology is too limited for families and ward families connected in Utah. Mormon nepotism doesn’t have to be direct, but it is alive and well- more than the stats collected represent. Familial connections could be indirect, through polygamous marriages and half-siblings, geographic proximity (especially in the old SLC wards), etc. As J. Golden Kimball said, being a GA is about 3 things: Revelation, inspiration, and relation.
Instead of trying to chase down every connection with every GA, or limiting the relations down too far, what about identifying GAs with NO known connections?
I thought Elder Bednar was the first non-related GA, but he’s a Whitney from his mother’s side. Or, he could be crossed off the list as the protege to the 13th apostle, Steven R.. Covey. (A little joke.) After that, I thought Elder Gong was the first non-related GA, but it turns out his wife is a Bangeter and Lindsay (daughter of a 70). I don’t know about the newest apostles, but since they are all Utahans, I think it’s likely we’re still at 100%.
It would be interesting to use the “no known” methodology and compare the male GAs to the female GAs. There are more women (e.g. Cheiko Okasaki comes to mind, Tracy Browning). There are also generations of wives, daughters and other relations so who knows.
Another methodology would be to look at the core family names from Nauvoo, Kirtland, Independence, early days in SLC, etc. and the families with close connections to the brethren and see how many of them have NO GAs. Maybe length of time plus proximity plus relation is the formula.