- Anon on Mimicry or New Religious Hotspot: Jesus-Figures and Joseph Smith-Figures in 1st Century Palestine and 19th-Century New York: “The Reformation took off not due to religious fervor, because there had always been periods of religious fervor in the European environment, but by the early 1500s there was a new technology that made new or revolutionary ideas go “viral” namely, the printing press. Mormonism took root and flourished because there were cultural, social, political and technological elements which aided its development.” Jun 10, 12:56
- on Mimicry or New Religious Hotspot: Jesus-Figures and Joseph Smith-Figures in 1st Century Palestine and 19th-Century New York: ““A thought experiment that kind of bugged me when I was younger was what would have happened if Joseph Smith was born in 2000s America, his brother knocked on my door telling me that his brother discovered Gold Plates and that God had restored the Church. Such a movement wouldn’t have made it very far, and I certainly wouldn’t have given them the time of day, so why would 1830s New York be any different? But it was, and that’s precisely the reason why it took off there.” THIS! For me…..the whole “Ongoing Restoration” narrative has become boring, worn out and quite useless.” Jun 10, 07:20
- on A Review: A New Translation of Isaiah: Based on Ancient Scrolls and Texts: “Click on the picture or either hyperlink. Or search on Amazon. Any of those will get you there!” Jun 10, 06:23
- on Mimicry or New Religious Hotspot: Jesus-Figures and Joseph Smith-Figures in 1st Century Palestine and 19th-Century New York: “And it suggests the people answering “Whom say ye that I am?” understood the difference between an itinerant rabble-rousing faith healer and the Son of God. The Reformation is another similar case – there were various reformists and critics as precursors who had minor impact and are nearly unknown today, and then Luther and dozens of other major Reformers appeared relatively suddenly all across Europe.” Jun 10, 04:27
- on A Review: A New Translation of Isaiah: Based on Ancient Scrolls and Texts: “How can I get a copy” Jun 9, 22:57
- on Unsettling Settler Mormon Lifeways: A Review of Elise Boxer’s Mormon Settler Colonialism by Jason Palmer: “Kirkstall, I appreciate you bringing those initiatives to our attention. That doesn’t feel like what the original post (or the book it is reviewing) is advocating, but is more something I can get behind.” Jun 9, 10:15
- on Unsettling Settler Mormon Lifeways: A Review of Elise Boxer’s Mormon Settler Colonialism by Jason Palmer: “Lots of defensiveness in this comment section without addressing the actual ideas in the post. If you spend even a few minutes googling this stuff, you’ll quickly learn that Land Back initiatives do not call for the abolition of the US government or the deportation of non-indigenous immigrants or their descendants. No one is asking you to right all the wrongs done by colonization. Land Back initiatives are pretty reasonable and achievable and typically involve restoring specific unceded tribal lands and honoring specific treaties that the US government violated. Is there a more abstract element of personal de-colonization and ending white supremacy? Yes! But your white guilt need not compel you to anything drastic. You can start by researching whose stolen land you actually live on and who those people are today—not just who they were in ye olden times. For example, I live on Chumash land in Southern California. The Chumash tribal council website is full of great information about what they’re working on and ways you can help. Donations to the foundation are a very low effort way to get involved. No one’s asking me to vacate and demolish my apartment, but the state of California is in the process of granting 7.5 million acres back to indigenous peoples this year, restoring a broken treaty from 175 years ago. I used to live in Provo on Timpanogos land. Most Mormons aren’t taught about the 1850 extermination order issued from Salt Lake to wipe out the Timpanogos, all because of a misunderstanding about a shirt and some cattle. TLDR: Mormon militiamen massacred the tribe, sticking the men’s heads on pikes outside Fort Utah and trafficking the women and children northward and placing them in white Mormon homes. The Timpanogos website today is not calling for vengeance or the demolition of BYU. On the contrary, in 2021 the Timpanogos chief executive collaborated with BYU ecology professor to present at a symposium on the health of Utah Lake. One of the website’s main features is a message of peace. From their page: “Though we were made to walk knee deep in the blood of our ancestors we must forgive and free our souls. The anguish that has held us captive must be released and allow the new sunlight to refresh our lives. We must remember that their prayers have carried us to a place of renewed strengths. Like our mountain that bears our name Timpanogos, we were, we are, and we shall remain.” Consider donating.” Jun 9, 10:04
- on Accepting Others Expression: How Did You Participate in Church (Or What Did Church Lead You to Think About) Yesterday, 6/7?: “I am in a country defending against another country’s invasion. Testimonies included pleas to God for the war to end and for protection for soldiers. The Sunday School lesson on Ruth and Hannah was hijacked by an old man who inserted himself four times (four lengthy times) to talk about how children aren’t growing up well, how parents are not doing their jobs raising them, how Hannah and Ruth had righteous desires because every woman should want to be a mother and how the country isn’t reproducing enough to maintain the population and women need to have more children, and how the other churches light their candles and have their ceremonies but it doesn’t do any good. Then, when we were already in overtime, a lady rose to say that the young people are the future of the country, and she has three sons fighting in the war instead of being at church, and instead of all the talking (such as the old man’s) we should be praying for her sons and all the young people who are fighting for the country. I thought the lady mirrored a Christ-like approach far more than the man, and was far more charitable. I am glad she spoke up. I fear I may have been somewhat uncharitable in my thoughts for the old man.” Jun 9, 01:38
- on Accepting Others Expression: How Did You Participate in Church (Or What Did Church Lead You to Think About) Yesterday, 6/7?: “Here’s a few of my thoughts in reaction to what happened recently in Church: Occasionally I’ve been in another ward when someone is sustained in a calling. It’s especially awkward in a small branch — you stick out when you don’t sustain everyone. Of course, this focuses on the social elements of sustaining, and the feelings about the individuals involved. I don’t think we make a big deal about when someone who isn’t part of the ward sustains a ward calling — technically they aren’t part of the group, so what does it mean when they sustain someone? If they are a one-time visitor and don’t know anyone, should they? But the pressure to sustain is real, and I often see visitors sustaining people. OTOH, I don’t think it is harmful in any way… I’ve also occasionally heard leaders say something like “that was a great prayer” after a prayer. What does that even mean? Are there criteria somewhere for what makes a great prayer that I’ve never heard? Is prayer about our egos, so we need encouragement or evaluation? OTOH, I’d hate for a new member to assume that they were doing it wrong or that members don’t like them because they didn’t get any positive reactions. So I don’t know what is the right thing to do or say. On an amusing note, in the middle of a comment in a lesson, the speaker used the phrase “Heavenly Father wants you to …” And for some reason my mind went to Uncle Sam recruiting posters. I could see it clearly, a missionary recruiting poster with a representation of God, and the line “Heavenly Father Wants You!” [GRIN] ” Jun 7, 21:45
- on Unsettling Settler Mormon Lifeways: A Review of Elise Boxer’s Mormon Settler Colonialism by Jason Palmer: “This isn’t satire. It’s very true to form for Jason, based on his Peruvian Mormons book. To Jason: you dismiss worrying any the logistics of decolonization as hand-wringing, but I think that’s the big sticking point. Are we talking about the hundreds of millions of Americans (across North and South America) without Native American ancestry getting deported as refugees and conpletely overwhelming all infrastructure in Europe, etc.? Or are you thinking it should be genocide? I don’t see a lot of other options if you are clearing the land for those whose ancestors lived in the Americas for time immemorial. And I don’t think those options will work- not enough people will voluntarily accept decolonization, and the few who are all in on it do not have the capability to force it to happen. So, what is the grand plan you have for the path forward? Or is this all just fun and games to you as an intellectual idea to be passionate about as long as it doesn’t have to correspond to reality in any way?” Jun 7, 20:32
