- Mortimer on CFM 10/19-10/25: Thoughts and Poetry for “Before I Formed Thee in the Belly I Knew Thee”: “Congratulations for wrapping a pro-life political message in scripture, poetry, premortal existence, and prophetic authority, and passing it off as a Sunday lesson follow-up. The timing, immediately following the LDS Church’s $1 million political donation in Idaho and ahead of the election, is hard to ignore. This is how you mobilize a religious audience without ever explicitly saying you’re doing it: embed the message in familiar theology, appeal to spiritual authority, and let members draw the intended conclusions themselves. You could have given SLC a lesson on playing the dog whistle. They might have been able to play it mores smoothly and avoid all the fuss. This is not appreciated.” Oct 12, 14:16
- on Latter-day Saint on Joe Rogan: “Just one example, in “marriage and sexuality” on celibacy. Professor Pablo A. Torijano of the Complutense University of Madrid aptly points out, the consensus of the “Third Quest for the Historical Jesus” (with scholars such as E.P. Sanders, John P. Meier, and Geza Vermes) insists that Jesus and his first followers operated entirely within the parameters of Galilean Common Judaism. • Marriage was the absolute norm: In that environment, marriage was not one “lifestyle choice” among several; it was the connective tissue of the economy, family survival, and religious duty. • Jesus’s celibacy: Although the historical Jesus probably did not marry—which was a striking eccentricity in his context—his central message was not an institutional endorsement of celibacy, but rather the apocalyptic proclamation of the imminence of the Kingdom of God. The first disciples (such as Peter, whose mother-in-law is explicitly mentioned in the texts) were married men who lived according to average Jewish customs. McClellan adopts a macroscopic and diachronic perspective (across the entirety of biblical history). In attempting to dismantle the modern theological argument for a “single, permanent biblical design for marriage,” McClellan assembles all the pieces that appear in the New Testament (including Paul’s letters and second-century texts) to demonstrate that the Bible contains contradictory narratives. However, in doing so, he flattens the sociological reality of 30 AD, where celibacy did not have nearly the same institutional or social status as marriage. So, was there diversity? Yes, of course. Can you flat to what Dan does in his videos? Nope. You must ponder and be honest with proportions, and explain what represented the most to the society in different times, especially in the inter-testamentary times (Also that being a paradox in those videos because Dan jumps from Mesopotamia to biblical time, to Jesus’ time even to rabbinic time… it’s a mess). And this affects the Petrine Church (term used by Antonio Piñero), the original jew christian movement that preserve all Jewish traditions, it exists high chances, in the first century of expecting that Jewish marriage would be the average, the norm in Jesus followers.” Oct 12, 14:01
- on Latter-day Saint on Joe Rogan: “I was reminded a little when reading the comments of when the Book of Mormon musical first came out–15 years ago, maybe–and journalists were looking for reasons why it was okay to like a musical that made fun of a religion. At some point, someone invited John Dehlin to an early performance of BoM and the NYT basically did an entire story saying, “Hey, this Mormon liked it, so it’s okay to make fun of them!” (Or that may just be my jaded recollection; it’s been a while.) And I remember thinking to myself that even if he was still on our books at the time, Dehlin wasn’t really much of a member anymore and seemed to have left the faith in all but word, so maybe he wasn’t the best member to represent us as as whole. And I knew all that because I’d been “on the blogs” for a lot of years before that, including John’s blog. FWIW, like what I’ve seen from Dan McLellan, though admittedly I’m not even a scholar, let alone a Biblical scholar. But like the Dehlin/NYT story, to the extent McLellan is going to be held out representative of what Mormons are or believe to the world as a whole, I think it’s fair to ask if he’s even still believing. What I admittedly don’t know is the extent to which people actually associate him with the Church.” Oct 12, 12:08
- on When Peace Is More Than Personal: “If you myopically look at this and a few other instances of official violence, this is a bad situation. Overall, violent crime is down dramatically in much of the US over the past few years. Drug overdose deaths have also been dropping. Many point to increased border enforcement and targeting of illegal alien criminals as prime reasons. I have seen some who want ICE agents to get significantly more training in proper use of force, conflict resolution, etc. This would probably help, but would require an increase in funding for federal law enforcement. Many of the most vocal in opposition to this type of enforcement would not want that. I would have loved to protest or stop the many abuses from federal and local governments against many US citizens from a few years ago. It took several years and multiple congressional elections before some serious changes started. I have not heard of a similar ICE encounter in my locale. I think that the local law enforcement will turn over arrested criminals if ICE asks. Raymond Winn, I can remember President Trump wanting to make a deal with congress on border security 7 years ago. He insisted on lots of funds to build a bigger border wall and increase border patrols. He was flexible in many other areas in negotiations, but congressional leaders did not want to make a deal. Many of the congressional leaders who are the loudest opponents of current ICE tactics could have probably got a deal with Trump to get ICE to use their preferred tactics back in 2018 or 2019. I suspect that a deal could be made now on ICE enforcement, but Trump would need a win in other areas to make that deal.” Oct 11, 23:39
- on The Bronze Threads of Fate: A Handbell Journey: “I had to smile at the Smash Bros album. I owe my love of orchestral music to childhood exposure to a record (yes, vinyl–I’m old) by the London Philharmonic with the Star Wars soundtrack on the front and Holst’s The Planets on the back.” Oct 11, 21:44
- on Latter-day Saint on Joe Rogan: “RLD, I have a strong testimony. I’m active and committed. I’m not going anywhere. I’m just so tired of the meanness!” Oct 11, 21:37
- on Attention Spans and Spiritual Diets in the 21st Century: “I think Anon and Roger D. Hansen bring up needed discussion points. Most short form content is not good for our spiritual well-being. On the other hand, I also think Roger is right, too many books and movies these days are too long, way too long. Some might get upset here, but that’s partly why I don’t like Brandon Sanderson anymore. Most of his books have become way too long and repetitive, both in messaging and characters. Personally, I felt that many of his female characters were just variations of Vin, who I deeply loved, but it became boring more or less reading the same story. Stephen: To push back gently, if you don’t find The Iliad to be exciting reading, the same can be said of the Standard Works. I’m mainly speaking about the OT and BofM, but the NT and D&C aren’t that much better. Objectively speaking, one could argue that The Iliad is more exciting than all of our Holy Writ, because it has a fairly tight narrative, etc. What I’m getting at, and you touch upon it in your post, is that there are things more important than just being “exciting”. If we’re being honest, most of the Great Books, both in the East and West aren’t all that exciting. However, the vast majority of them are deeply spiritual or philosophically important to the development of our civilization. I would argue that this constant need/search for excitement is spiritually damning to our souls. I’m not going to argue that this is a uniquely modern problem, since sin, especially sexual, lives off of constantly needing new excitement. Put simply, we need to make Psalm 46:10 a part of our lives, especially within the temple: “Be still, and know that I am God: I will be exalted among the heathen, I will be exalted in the earth.”” Oct 11, 21:10
- on The Bronze Threads of Fate: A Handbell Journey: “Jonathan, it’s a great aspect of handbells. I’ve been collecting stories of how each ensemble that exists in Utah came to be, and there is a lot of that. A couple of those stories even involved teenagers going out and doing fund raising by selling sandwiches or candy bars to be able to purchase a set of bells. It’s fun. Thanks, Mom! You’re definitely one of the heroes of this story.” Oct 11, 20:46
- on Latter-day Saint on Joe Rogan: “@PWS: “The gift of testimony is deeply personal. It is received in the intimacy of our relationship with God and shaped according to our unique experiences, circumstances, and needs….Your testimony may be different from mine or that of other family members or fellow Saints. Please trust it, nurture it, and bear it, because it is uniquely yours.” –Elder Gérald Caussé (last week) “Preserve, then, the freedom of your mind in education and in religion, and be unafraid to express your thoughts and to insist upon your right to examine every proposition. We are not so much concerned with whether your thoughts are orthodox or heterodox as we are that you shall have thoughts.” –President Hugh B. Brown There will always be voices calling for orthodoxy in the Church as well as voices that value differences. That’s rooted in human nature and some of the fundamental ways people differ. At the leadership level, it feels like those who value differences are ascendant, or at least ascending, perhaps because exposure to the global Church makes them realize the gospel doesn’t make everyone the same. But your ward may vary. I hope you’ll insist on participating in your ward whether you’re welcome or not. It’s your Church too. And in my experience, if you contribute to the community you’ll eventually convince people you really do mean well and will be accepted. As someone told Eugene England, “Gene, you’ve got to keep your hair short and always do your home teaching, to show you’re really OK despite your liberal ideas.” (I’m not endorsing the hair part.) Sing in the choir if you can. Not only is it a good way to contribute; you’ll find good people there. @Lion of the Lord: Seems to me that as the mainstream right has lost its way in the United States it has become easier to see that the Church was independent of it all along. You’re absolutely correct that it doesn’t work to try to fit the Church onto the left/right spectrum. The pluralism that President Oaks endorsed in his recent speech on the Constitution used to be a bedrock of the American creed, but now it doesn’t really fit in either party.” Oct 11, 20:42
