Comments on: Different Hardnesses to the Truth – Reading Nephi – 16:1-6 https://www.timesandseasons.org/index.php/2017/10/reading-nephi-161-6/ Truth Will Prevail Sun, 05 Aug 2018 23:56:25 +0000 hourly 1 https://wordpress.org/?v=4.9.8 By: Rick https://www.timesandseasons.org/index.php/2017/10/reading-nephi-161-6/#comment-543073 Mon, 20 Nov 2017 19:05:04 +0000 http://www.timesandseasons.org/?p=37116#comment-543073 This is very good and brings out well what you’ve alluded to: what is righteousness (good)? On the surface, this lecture in Nephi 16 seems absolutely appropriate. After all, Nephi is “righteous” and Laman and Lemuel are “unrighteous”, as we learn in “I will go, I will do…”. But what we also have is a man who has murdered – beheaded! – another person who was passed out, stolen property, and kidnapped another person — lecturing two individuals who, although they have threatened to do bad stuff, have done none of those things. Their basic crime is whining because their father (with family) has left his home in Jerusalem for a terrible life in the wilderness and not recognizing their younger brother as their leader. (yes, the above is a simplification, but you get my point).

As LDS’s we acknowledge and raise our hands to accept 15 men as Prophet, Seers, and Revelators, and especial witnesses of Jesus. When one reads the definition of each of these things in our scriptures, it’s quite mind-boggling what these titles represent. These men are fully aware of how the faithful look on them, in any testimony meeting you will hear how – particularly the president of the Church – has absolute direct communication with God and angels. The question then becomes that, no matter what their good intentions or motivations are, if these 15 men are not Prophets, Seers, and Revelators in every sense that the scriptures state, are they being “righteous” to present themselves as such.

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By: Rob Osborn https://www.timesandseasons.org/index.php/2017/10/reading-nephi-161-6/#comment-542777 Mon, 09 Oct 2017 19:16:48 +0000 http://www.timesandseasons.org/?p=37116#comment-542777 I am sure Nephi was being as kind and humble as a prophet should be fir we read in these same verses-

4 And it came to pass that I, Nephi, did exhort my brethren, with all diligence, to keep the commandments of the Lord.
5 And it came to pass that they did humble themselves before the Lord; insomuch that I had joy and great hopes of them, that they would walk in the paths of righteousness.

This is the type of kind, yet firm, dialogue towards a loved one that brings the end result even if it was just temporary. It says that Nephi had great joy for them. So, I am not quite sure where Nephi unhumbly is getting after his brothers. The text actually makes the opposite case.

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By: Jerry Schmidt https://www.timesandseasons.org/index.php/2017/10/reading-nephi-161-6/#comment-542775 Mon, 09 Oct 2017 13:37:13 +0000 http://www.timesandseasons.org/?p=37116#comment-542775 One, we certainly tend to perceive Nephi and the conflict with his brothers not in their context, but in ours. We do not actually put ourselves in their time and place, but rather transport them to our time and place. In part, this may in part be due to the uncertainty of time and place as it applies to the Book of Mormon. We may be stumbling over our own personal issues with historicity.

However, if I can appreciate the narrative of Joseph and his older brothets and their relationship with their father/prophet, certainly that gives me a framework for understanding Nephi and Sam and Laman and Lemuel.

Older brothers, performing their ranching duties as expected, but along comes the “dreamer” and upstart Joseph, who gets a technicolor dreamcoat even, and tells them he will rule over them, the elder brothers.

This has all happened before, and it will all happen again, espescially as Lehi is descended from Joseph, notJudah. Is it so surprising the family “curse” of envy and political wrangling still shows up through the succeeding generations?

Laman and Lemuel didn’t eventually take the option to sell Nephi off, they went with their first imclination: Let’s kill him, and follow in the footsteps of Cain.

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By: Glenn Thigpen https://www.timesandseasons.org/index.php/2017/10/reading-nephi-161-6/#comment-542774 Mon, 09 Oct 2017 11:50:03 +0000 http://www.timesandseasons.org/?p=37116#comment-542774 There are a few things that we have to remember here. The story that Nephi narrates is a bare bones affair. There is so much more to the story and the conversations that he necessarily leaves out. Nephi was thrust into a situation that he did not really ask for. I have seen many people comment negatively on Nephi (who admitted to having a score of weaknesses, however murmuring against the commandments of God was not one of them) and point out the primogeniture context of Laman’s rebellion. But it was the angel that appeared to the group when Laman and Lemuel were beating Nephi and Sam who told Laman and Lemuel that Nephi had been chosen to rule over them because of their wickedness. Had Laman and Lemuel been left in charge, we would not be having this conversation.

The forgotten man in this equation seems to be Lehi. He does not seem to have been a leader. That he was a righteous man is not in question. That he was a man that loved his children passionately is also evident in the words that Nephi spoke. Yet it was Nephi that had to stand up to his brothers on several occasions when his father, the head of the household, seemingly remained silent. It seems that a youthful Nephi was forced by circumstances beyond his control to accept a leadership role that God conferred upon him, and this sooner maybe than it should be because of his father’s seemingly retiring nature. It was the father that was the titular leader of the clan who should have been stepping in and controlling the narrative. But he appears to be more like Eli in the Old Testament, a righteous man but for some reason loath to try to control the unrighteous actions of his two oldest children. It does not appear that Lehi was physically ailing or frail as he fathered two more children during the trek to Bountiful.

Nephi’s words can seem unhumble to some. He maybe could have approached things a little differently (and just may have done so at first, but it just not be included in the narrative) but he was in an on-the-job-training type of situation. However, when one looks back on the different prophets that have addressed their contemporaries, calling them to repentance, their words were probably not viewed as being very humble to those that were on the receiving end. I imagine that the Sadducees and Pharisees did not appreciate Jesus’ words when he called them a generation of vipers, and I doubt that the priest’s of Baal found Elijah very humble when he was mocking them as they entreated Baal to fire up their sacrifice for them. Nephi’s words seem pretty benign compared to those two examples.

Glenn

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