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	<title>Comments on: Notes From All Over &#8211; thru May 17</title>
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	<link>http://timesandseasons.org/index.php/2009/05/notes-from-all-over-thru-may-17/</link>
	<description>Truth Will Prevail</description>
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		<title>By: Phill</title>
		<link>http://timesandseasons.org/index.php/2009/05/notes-from-all-over-thru-may-17/#comment-292617</link>
		<dc:creator>Phill</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 May 2009 05:47:51 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>They say such nice things about people at their funerals that it makes me sad to realize that I&#039;m going to miss mine by just a few days.
 http://apotut.ifrance.com/health-literacy-definition.html - health literacy definition</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>They say such nice things about people at their funerals that it makes me sad to realize that I&#8217;m going to miss mine by just a few days.<br />
 <a href="http://apotut.ifrance.com/health-literacy-definition.html" rel="nofollow">http://apotut.ifrance.com/health-literacy-definition.html</a> &#8211; health literacy definition</p>
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		<title>By: Dan</title>
		<link>http://timesandseasons.org/index.php/2009/05/notes-from-all-over-thru-may-17/#comment-292200</link>
		<dc:creator>Dan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 May 2009 03:22:57 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Kent,

I recommend you watch &quot;Taxi to the Dark Side&quot; and see exactly what Bybee authorized. Just know, the documentary holds nothing back and can be very disturbing. Dark Side indeed.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Kent,</p>
<p>I recommend you watch &#8220;Taxi to the Dark Side&#8221; and see exactly what Bybee authorized. Just know, the documentary holds nothing back and can be very disturbing. Dark Side indeed.</p>
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		<title>By: Kent Larsen</title>
		<link>http://timesandseasons.org/index.php/2009/05/notes-from-all-over-thru-may-17/#comment-292141</link>
		<dc:creator>Kent Larsen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 May 2009 03:20:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://timesandseasons.org/?p=8285#comment-292141</guid>
		<description>Tim, I remember reading somewhere a few years ago that Randy followed Tal out of the Church. Proximate cause was DNA and the Book of Mormon.

I was very disappointed to learn this, which is probably why it stuck in my mind, I think. I like Bachman, and read a biography several years ago. He has a great story, and I&#039;ve always felt that the LDS community has never given him the attention he deserved, given his notariety.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tim, I remember reading somewhere a few years ago that Randy followed Tal out of the Church. Proximate cause was DNA and the Book of Mormon.</p>
<p>I was very disappointed to learn this, which is probably why it stuck in my mind, I think. I like Bachman, and read a biography several years ago. He has a great story, and I&#8217;ve always felt that the LDS community has never given him the attention he deserved, given his notariety.</p>
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		<title>By: Tim</title>
		<link>http://timesandseasons.org/index.php/2009/05/notes-from-all-over-thru-may-17/#comment-292133</link>
		<dc:creator>Tim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 May 2009 23:59:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://timesandseasons.org/?p=8285#comment-292133</guid>
		<description>Kent,
I know this is a more recent note, but isn&#039;t Bachman still LDS?  I thought it was his son who left the church.
Wikipedia isn&#039;t much help to me here, but my understanding is that Randy Bachman is still a practicing member.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Kent,<br />
I know this is a more recent note, but isn&#8217;t Bachman still LDS?  I thought it was his son who left the church.<br />
Wikipedia isn&#8217;t much help to me here, but my understanding is that Randy Bachman is still a practicing member.</p>
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		<title>By: Ross</title>
		<link>http://timesandseasons.org/index.php/2009/05/notes-from-all-over-thru-may-17/#comment-292130</link>
		<dc:creator>Ross</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 May 2009 21:32:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://timesandseasons.org/?p=8285#comment-292130</guid>
		<description>A calm correction to my 1:35 p.m. comment:  It should have read &quot;FBI Director &lt;i&gt;Robert&lt;/i&gt; Mueller,&quot; not William.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A calm correction to my 1:35 p.m. comment:  It should have read &#8220;FBI Director <i>Robert</i> Mueller,&#8221; not William.</p>
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		<title>By: Frank McIntyre</title>
		<link>http://timesandseasons.org/index.php/2009/05/notes-from-all-over-thru-may-17/#comment-292124</link>
		<dc:creator>Frank McIntyre</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 May 2009 19:05:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://timesandseasons.org/?p=8285#comment-292124</guid>
		<description>Ross and AM, please calm down.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ross and AM, please calm down.</p>
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		<title>By: Ross</title>
		<link>http://timesandseasons.org/index.php/2009/05/notes-from-all-over-thru-may-17/#comment-292123</link>
		<dc:creator>Ross</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 May 2009 18:35:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://timesandseasons.org/?p=8285#comment-292123</guid>
		<description>aloysiusmiller,

Thanks again for the opportunity to discuss Bybee in context.

Just as an aside to you, an ad hominem attack evades the substance of an argument while attacking the source.  In your case there is no substantive argument at all, just your own &lt;i&gt;ipse dixit&lt;/i&gt; attestations about Bybee&#039;s character.  Since you are your only source for those attestations, pointing out your own lack of credibility is quite fair.

Meanwhile, let&#039;s return to your wholly unsupported claim that Bybee was &quot;courageous.&quot;  I have already explained above how the circumstances of his employment show the very opposite pattern.  Now let&#039;s look at an example what real moral courage by Justice Department lawyers in his position looked like:

When Bybee&#039;s successor at OLC -- Jack Goldsmith, a solidly conservative Republican lawyer  -- saw all those secret legal opinions, he was aghast at many of them.  He rescinded Bybee&#039;s torture memo to the White House, and several other secret memos we haven&#039;t even seen yet.  One of those opinions supported the early version of an NSA surveillance program, which Goldsmith found to be illegal.

OLC chief Goldsmith, and his solidly conservative superiors (Atty. Gen. John Ashcroft, who was critically hopitalized at the time, and Deputy Atty. Gen. James Comey) dramatically confronted the White House over it in 2004.  They, FBI Director William Mueller and more than 20 other senior Justice Department lawyers all threatened to resign if the program remained in effect.  Bush backed down and modified the program.  (To this day, we don&#039;t know the details of what that egregiously illegal surveillance program actually was, but it had been operating from late 2001 through March 2004.)

&lt;i&gt;That&lt;/i&gt; was moral courage.  Bybee apparently had none of it.  He just went along in secret and got his lifetime appointment to the bench.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>aloysiusmiller,</p>
<p>Thanks again for the opportunity to discuss Bybee in context.</p>
<p>Just as an aside to you, an ad hominem attack evades the substance of an argument while attacking the source.  In your case there is no substantive argument at all, just your own <i>ipse dixit</i> attestations about Bybee&#8217;s character.  Since you are your only source for those attestations, pointing out your own lack of credibility is quite fair.</p>
<p>Meanwhile, let&#8217;s return to your wholly unsupported claim that Bybee was &#8220;courageous.&#8221;  I have already explained above how the circumstances of his employment show the very opposite pattern.  Now let&#8217;s look at an example what real moral courage by Justice Department lawyers in his position looked like:</p>
<p>When Bybee&#8217;s successor at OLC &#8212; Jack Goldsmith, a solidly conservative Republican lawyer  &#8212; saw all those secret legal opinions, he was aghast at many of them.  He rescinded Bybee&#8217;s torture memo to the White House, and several other secret memos we haven&#8217;t even seen yet.  One of those opinions supported the early version of an NSA surveillance program, which Goldsmith found to be illegal.</p>
<p>OLC chief Goldsmith, and his solidly conservative superiors (Atty. Gen. John Ashcroft, who was critically hopitalized at the time, and Deputy Atty. Gen. James Comey) dramatically confronted the White House over it in 2004.  They, FBI Director William Mueller and more than 20 other senior Justice Department lawyers all threatened to resign if the program remained in effect.  Bush backed down and modified the program.  (To this day, we don&#8217;t know the details of what that egregiously illegal surveillance program actually was, but it had been operating from late 2001 through March 2004.)</p>
<p><i>That</i> was moral courage.  Bybee apparently had none of it.  He just went along in secret and got his lifetime appointment to the bench.</p>
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		<title>By: aloysiusmiller</title>
		<link>http://timesandseasons.org/index.php/2009/05/notes-from-all-over-thru-may-17/#comment-292120</link>
		<dc:creator>aloysiusmiller</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 May 2009 18:04:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://timesandseasons.org/?p=8285#comment-292120</guid>
		<description>Ad hominem attacks are just fine if they are aimed in the right direction. 

Bybee is a saint.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ad hominem attacks are just fine if they are aimed in the right direction. </p>
<p>Bybee is a saint.</p>
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		<title>By: Ross</title>
		<link>http://timesandseasons.org/index.php/2009/05/notes-from-all-over-thru-may-17/#comment-292118</link>
		<dc:creator>Ross</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 May 2009 17:18:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://timesandseasons.org/?p=8285#comment-292118</guid>
		<description>Dan,

I know he is a troll.  But he is an incompetent troll who happens to be representative of a lot of wrongheaded opinion out there.  (People need not even read the &quot;friends of Bybee&quot; web site.  The troll&#039;s comments encapsulate its propaganda perfectly.)

Those comments actually have provided me an opportunity to lay out many of the issues about Bybee, which otherwise would have required a single long blog post to explain.

So if aloysiusmiller did not exist, I would wish that someone invent him.  I have no delusion that he will ever be persuaded. But as the archetype of mindless propaganda on this matter, he is a useful tool.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dan,</p>
<p>I know he is a troll.  But he is an incompetent troll who happens to be representative of a lot of wrongheaded opinion out there.  (People need not even read the &#8220;friends of Bybee&#8221; web site.  The troll&#8217;s comments encapsulate its propaganda perfectly.)</p>
<p>Those comments actually have provided me an opportunity to lay out many of the issues about Bybee, which otherwise would have required a single long blog post to explain.</p>
<p>So if aloysiusmiller did not exist, I would wish that someone invent him.  I have no delusion that he will ever be persuaded. But as the archetype of mindless propaganda on this matter, he is a useful tool.</p>
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		<title>By: Dan</title>
		<link>http://timesandseasons.org/index.php/2009/05/notes-from-all-over-thru-may-17/#comment-292113</link>
		<dc:creator>Dan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 May 2009 16:13:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://timesandseasons.org/?p=8285#comment-292113</guid>
		<description>Ross,

Aloysius is a troll on this issue. He has nothing of substance to add. He will keep on repeating &quot;Bybee is a saint&quot; because that&#039;s the only thing he can say. Don&#039;t feed this troll.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ross,</p>
<p>Aloysius is a troll on this issue. He has nothing of substance to add. He will keep on repeating &#8220;Bybee is a saint&#8221; because that&#8217;s the only thing he can say. Don&#8217;t feed this troll.</p>
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