Comments on: What Should Mormons Do?

By: Jeff T.

Jeff T. — Fri, 21 Nov 2008 07:23:15 +0000

Kent,

Yeah, it’s the law. I disagree with it though. I agree that people shouldn’t discriminate based upon religion, but I think the government is stepping outside its proper role by enforcing it. I think part of freedom is freedom of association, which means should be able to freely choose the people we associate with in daily life (in terms of who we purchase from, who we sell to, who we hire, etc.)

By: Raymond Takashi Swenson

Raymond Takashi Swenson — Wed, 19 Nov 2008 00:19:06 +0000

I was interested in the comment about Mormons in sewnior positions at Los Alamos. I have worked in the Department of Energy national complex of sites for 11 years, mainly in eastern Idaho (where the population is 50% LDS) and in eastern Washington, where LDS are about 15% of the population. Yet the LDS presence in senior leadership positions within the Department of Energy itself is basically ZERO in both places. There are many LDS in lower level jobs, but they have not been selected for the 15 or so senior leadership positions in each local DOE office. Just on the basis of statistical improbability (which the Civil Rights laws allow as evidence of discrimination), there appears to be specific discrimination AGAINST LDS people in DOE. Maybe this is not intentionally religious in nature. Mormons are just not likely to hang out with the other senior managers on weekends, going to wine tastings and performances of The Vagina Monologues and playing golf on Sundays. The fact is that the formal hiring processes, which involve written applications and (sometimes) phone and in person interviews rarely seem to be the real basis for selection for positions that become vacant. Ultimately it is really based on a personal relationship with a particular senior person who influences the selection. Just as Mormons feel more comfortable hanging out with each other, non-Mormons tend to hang out together and build networks of personal relationships outside the office with non-Mormons.

By: Kent Larsen

Kent Larsen — Mon, 17 Nov 2008 12:06:54 +0000

Jeff T. (41):
Your question concerns what the law says. I suggest you look at the wikipedia article on Employment discrimination law in the United States, which indicates that no employer (including those privately owned) with more than 15 employees and engaged in interstate commerce may discriminate on the basis of religion (and several other “protected categories”).

Doesn’t sound like you are in favor of this law, but this has been the law since the Civil Rights Act of 1964.

By: Jeff T.

Jeff T. — Mon, 17 Nov 2008 07:10:38 +0000

Is the university privately owned? If so, first of all, regardless of whether discrimination actually happened, I see no reason at all why a privately owned university can’t play favorites or be picky. The government should have NO say in the criteria for who a privately owned enterprise can or can’t hire.

By: Dave

Dave — Sun, 16 Nov 2008 15:42:53 +0000

I’m wondering why everyone seems to be ignoring post #11.

By: Velska

Velska — Fri, 14 Nov 2008 11:03:54 +0000

In my environment I am extremely unlikely to run into many Mormons in professional life (we are a really small minority).

But I admit that when I meet a Mormon, I immediately feel a certain kinship. Kind of like when I meet a “paisano” while traveling abroad (at least outside mainstream tourist traps) or hearing my native language spoken somewhere unexpectedly. You know there is something about you that the other one instinctively recognizes – although you may have little in common.

Lately there have also been positive mention about LDS work ethic here. May be a contributing factor, besides the networking thing, which is always present – it always helps to have something in common with the guy/gal doing the hiring.

By: mlu

mlu — Fri, 14 Nov 2008 06:03:13 +0000

If members of certain tribes really are more or less likely to exhibit certain traits than members of other tribes, one who is trying to get particular things done would not be foolish to lean toward members of the tribe most likely to have the desired traits.

Why else would liberals be a little averse to hiring evangelicals?

By: Adam Greenwood

Adam Greenwood — Thu, 13 Nov 2008 22:03:02 +0000

I endorse Jeremiah J. and Nate Oman’s comments.

Frank M., 36k/person does sound like a ‘go away’ settlement.

By: Anonymous

Anonymous — Thu, 13 Nov 2008 20:58:55 +0000

As a young man (age 18),my Stake President refused to re-hire me for a summer job (despite making me commit to two summers when I was initially hired) because I didn’t pay tithing and he felt that if I wasn’t appreciative enough of the job he hired me to do, he would hire someone who would pay tithing. So finding evidence of favoritism amongst members of the church isn’t outside of my realm of belief.

Part of it is simply networking, as has previously been mentioned. Some of it is a belief that Mormons are better workers, more honest, etc (think Howard Hughes), and some of it is one member wanting to give preferential treatment to one of their own. Just more of the “natural man” we are supposed to overcome.

By: Jeremiah J.

Jeremiah J. — Thu, 13 Nov 2008 20:07:10 +0000

All these references to “tribalism” and human nature are flying way above the specific features of Mormon tribalism or chauvinism. There are many different kinds of “tribes”, and the claim that “tribes favor their own” is almost tautological. People are behave tribally whenever they do.

In the case of Mormonism, the evidence I’ve seen is that tribalism is actually pretty strong. Particular, rather than universal alliegance may come more naturally to human beings, but that doesn’t mean that everyone favors some tribe just as strongly as Mormons favor theirs. David Campbell, a political scientist at Notre Dame, has some research which shows that that Mormons like other Mormons more than blacks like blacks, Hispanics like Hispanics, Jews like Jews, Catholics like Catholics, and Evangleicals like Evangelicals. Way more.

But this also seems to indicate that our tribalism is positive (or “affirmative”), not primarily negative, and in my own experience as well that seems true. It’s not that we are especially suspicious of or antagonistic towards non-Mormons. It’s that we really like Mormons. That’s much more difficult to write off as a bad thing, for the simple fact that trust is ceteris paribus a good thing.