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	<title>Comments on: Expecting Kangaroo Fur</title>
	<atom:link href="http://timesandseasons.org/index.php/2006/05/expecting-kangaroo-fur/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://timesandseasons.org/index.php/2006/05/expecting-kangaroo-fur/</link>
	<description>Truth Will Prevail</description>
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		<title>By: Doug</title>
		<link>http://timesandseasons.org/index.php/2006/05/expecting-kangaroo-fur/#comment-185895</link>
		<dc:creator>Doug</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 May 2006 23:06:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.timesandseasons.org/?p=3178#comment-185895</guid>
		<description>By the way, there is something interesting I heard lately about the John Taylor watch that the church has.  After an expert examined it, he concluded it was certainly not struck by a bullet or ball from a gun or musket but was damaged when John Taylor fell against the edge of a table.  The watch struck by a bullet myth was started and it has nevered died.  The information comes from Grant Palmer.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>By the way, there is something interesting I heard lately about the John Taylor watch that the church has.  After an expert examined it, he concluded it was certainly not struck by a bullet or ball from a gun or musket but was damaged when John Taylor fell against the edge of a table.  The watch struck by a bullet myth was started and it has nevered died.  The information comes from Grant Palmer.</p>
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		<title>By: Nate Oman</title>
		<link>http://timesandseasons.org/index.php/2006/05/expecting-kangaroo-fur/#comment-184657</link>
		<dc:creator>Nate Oman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 May 2006 15:34:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.timesandseasons.org/?p=3178#comment-184657</guid>
		<description>FWIW, I have talked to at least one person who has worked with the Strengthening the Members Committee.  He described it as a glorified clipping service.  His own involvement consisted of being asked to visit a man who had asked that his name be removed from the records of the Church in a last ditch effort to persaude the man to stay.  My friend was told that the man was very antagonistic, and he should simply identify himself as being &quot;sent by the Church.&quot;  My friend was unsuccessful in resolving any of the man&#039;s concerns, but at the conclusion of the conversation, the man said, &quot;This has been a good discussion.  I am glad that you came.  I am just glad you aren&#039;t one of those bastards from the Strengthening the Members Committee.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>FWIW, I have talked to at least one person who has worked with the Strengthening the Members Committee.  He described it as a glorified clipping service.  His own involvement consisted of being asked to visit a man who had asked that his name be removed from the records of the Church in a last ditch effort to persaude the man to stay.  My friend was told that the man was very antagonistic, and he should simply identify himself as being &#8220;sent by the Church.&#8221;  My friend was unsuccessful in resolving any of the man&#8217;s concerns, but at the conclusion of the conversation, the man said, &#8220;This has been a good discussion.  I am glad that you came.  I am just glad you aren&#8217;t one of those bastards from the Strengthening the Members Committee.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: Wacky Hermit</title>
		<link>http://timesandseasons.org/index.php/2006/05/expecting-kangaroo-fur/#comment-184626</link>
		<dc:creator>Wacky Hermit</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 May 2006 14:40:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.timesandseasons.org/?p=3178#comment-184626</guid>
		<description>The smell of Mormonism: Funeral Potatoes!  Potatoes so tasty you just can&#039;t wait to die! ;)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The smell of Mormonism: Funeral Potatoes!  Potatoes so tasty you just can&#8217;t wait to die! ;)</p>
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		<title>By: grego</title>
		<link>http://timesandseasons.org/index.php/2006/05/expecting-kangaroo-fur/#comment-184364</link>
		<dc:creator>grego</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 May 2006 02:29:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.timesandseasons.org/?p=3178#comment-184364</guid>
		<description>The smell of an alcohol factory--from the first area in my mission.  
The smell of stale bread, coffee, and a few days without a shower--from most of my mission.
The running of my finger in the bullet hole in the door, and over the blood on the floor, of Carthage jail.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The smell of an alcohol factory&#8211;from the first area in my mission.<br />
The smell of stale bread, coffee, and a few days without a shower&#8211;from most of my mission.<br />
The running of my finger in the bullet hole in the door, and over the blood on the floor, of Carthage jail.</p>
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		<title>By: Kimball L. Hunt</title>
		<link>http://timesandseasons.org/index.php/2006/05/expecting-kangaroo-fur/#comment-183848</link>
		<dc:creator>Kimball L. Hunt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 May 2006 03:59:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.timesandseasons.org/?p=3178#comment-183848</guid>
		<description>And: one LAST point, I promise!

Beck&#039;s book was said by Alex to have been originally pitched by her to her publisher AS A WORK OF FICTION! And yet the publisher, Alex said, apparently insisted it be minorly reworked into a memoirs!!!!! How ironic! 
- - -
Publisher: &quot;You know, brother, this is based on your true life, is it not? Why don&#039;t you let us call this a memoirs! And in the parts where it&#039;s fictionalized, well, y&#039;know, ya really can&#039;t let your being over obsessed with the truth get in the way of an interesting story!&quot; And you really shouldn&#039;t let the truth get in the way of a good story!&quot;

Author: &quot;Yeah, I guess you&#039;re right: Chi-chinggg!!!&quot;
- - -
Lol. So: Martha&#039;s Oprah Mag -reviewed &quot;LEAVING THE SAINTS was BEFORE her James Frey fiasco! . . . Yet, DESPITE the controversy LEAVING had caused, no one paid it any mind UNTIL mister Frey&#039;s came on board. And then when internet sleuths quickly figured out that HIS publishers had forced his fiction to parade as memoirs it&#039;s only THEN everybody finally stood up and took notice. Go figure.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And: one LAST point, I promise!</p>
<p>Beck&#8217;s book was said by Alex to have been originally pitched by her to her publisher AS A WORK OF FICTION! And yet the publisher, Alex said, apparently insisted it be minorly reworked into a memoirs!!!!! How ironic!<br />
- &#8211; -<br />
Publisher: &#8220;You know, brother, this is based on your true life, is it not? Why don&#8217;t you let us call this a memoirs! And in the parts where it&#8217;s fictionalized, well, y&#8217;know, ya really can&#8217;t let your being over obsessed with the truth get in the way of an interesting story!&#8221; And you really shouldn&#8217;t let the truth get in the way of a good story!&#8221;</p>
<p>Author: &#8220;Yeah, I guess you&#8217;re right: Chi-chinggg!!!&#8221;<br />
- &#8211; -<br />
Lol. So: Martha&#8217;s Oprah Mag -reviewed &#8220;LEAVING THE SAINTS was BEFORE her James Frey fiasco! . . . Yet, DESPITE the controversy LEAVING had caused, no one paid it any mind UNTIL mister Frey&#8217;s came on board. And then when internet sleuths quickly figured out that HIS publishers had forced his fiction to parade as memoirs it&#8217;s only THEN everybody finally stood up and took notice. Go figure.</p>
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		<title>By: Kimball L. Hunt</title>
		<link>http://timesandseasons.org/index.php/2006/05/expecting-kangaroo-fur/#comment-183832</link>
		<dc:creator>Kimball L. Hunt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 May 2006 03:25:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.timesandseasons.org/?p=3178#comment-183832</guid>
		<description>APJ: Lol.

Mark: Hm: a sorta assigned /volunteer clipping service? (Your educated guess/ assumption, Mark, or you&#039;ve you actually heard tell?)
=====
Oh, one more thing I remember from when sister Martha Beck&#039;s book came out. She was on an NPR show that brought her brother Alex, too. Anyway, Martha was on first and she had it that her fam was completely ignoring her, wouldn&#039;t talk to her, would have nothing to do with her.

Then after Alex comes on, it turns out that the fam had been trying desperately to have contact with Martha since the time she was finishing up the book and it was coming out, without success. 
- - -
All lightheartedness aside here, though, folks (and I seriously mean that . . . !) But, Martha sounded like somebody who&#039;s deeply troubled. And this makes you wonder if maybe this being-so-troubled was DUE to some kind of nefarious abuse in her childhood?; sort of like: first they abuse ya so much that they make you crazy, then they say noone can believe ya about this abuse caus, well, you&#039;re obviously so crazy? Or, alteranately, the sort of intensity obsessiveness that genetically predisposed Nibley to be such a prolific scholar/ apologetic advocate, in Martha&#039;s particular hothouse-strain makes her prone to promoting whimsy upon whimsy upon whimsy?; e.(-xempli g.(-ratia): claims she wasn&#039;t hypnotized, when she was; neglects to mention she suffered abuse by a neighbor boy; neglects to mention, within memoirs dealing with angst vis-a-vis the Church, she&#039;s gay; claims her family won&#039;t speak to her when the exact opposite was the case; imagines the Latter-day Saint&#039;s Work-of-God volunteers might be manning some room, somewhere, 24/7 so they can monitor all her telephone conversations? 

OK: With that very last reference to a couple of &quot;reasonably&quot; paranoid (which is a contradiction in terms, but still -- lol), passing references in sister Beck&#039;s book to where she&#039;s worrying about hearing clicks on her phone . . . maybe I&#039;m startin to get lighthearted again. Sorry. But -- still -- the whole picture of Beck&#039;s tales&#039; seeming modus operandi of being selected for emotional &#039;n&#039; emotive effect over mere adherence to independently &#039;n&#039; objectively verifiable truth does make me kinda wonder what way-out-there stuff her editor excised for being too whackily over the top to be believable?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>APJ: Lol.</p>
<p>Mark: Hm: a sorta assigned /volunteer clipping service? (Your educated guess/ assumption, Mark, or you&#8217;ve you actually heard tell?)<br />
=====<br />
Oh, one more thing I remember from when sister Martha Beck&#8217;s book came out. She was on an NPR show that brought her brother Alex, too. Anyway, Martha was on first and she had it that her fam was completely ignoring her, wouldn&#8217;t talk to her, would have nothing to do with her.</p>
<p>Then after Alex comes on, it turns out that the fam had been trying desperately to have contact with Martha since the time she was finishing up the book and it was coming out, without success.<br />
- &#8211; -<br />
All lightheartedness aside here, though, folks (and I seriously mean that . . . !) But, Martha sounded like somebody who&#8217;s deeply troubled. And this makes you wonder if maybe this being-so-troubled was DUE to some kind of nefarious abuse in her childhood?; sort of like: first they abuse ya so much that they make you crazy, then they say noone can believe ya about this abuse caus, well, you&#8217;re obviously so crazy? Or, alteranately, the sort of intensity obsessiveness that genetically predisposed Nibley to be such a prolific scholar/ apologetic advocate, in Martha&#8217;s particular hothouse-strain makes her prone to promoting whimsy upon whimsy upon whimsy?; e.(-xempli g.(-ratia): claims she wasn&#8217;t hypnotized, when she was; neglects to mention she suffered abuse by a neighbor boy; neglects to mention, within memoirs dealing with angst vis-a-vis the Church, she&#8217;s gay; claims her family won&#8217;t speak to her when the exact opposite was the case; imagines the Latter-day Saint&#8217;s Work-of-God volunteers might be manning some room, somewhere, 24/7 so they can monitor all her telephone conversations? </p>
<p>OK: With that very last reference to a couple of &#8220;reasonably&#8221; paranoid (which is a contradiction in terms, but still &#8212; lol), passing references in sister Beck&#8217;s book to where she&#8217;s worrying about hearing clicks on her phone . . . maybe I&#8217;m startin to get lighthearted again. Sorry. But &#8212; still &#8212; the whole picture of Beck&#8217;s tales&#8217; seeming modus operandi of being selected for emotional &#8216;n&#8217; emotive effect over mere adherence to independently &#8216;n&#8217; objectively verifiable truth does make me kinda wonder what way-out-there stuff her editor excised for being too whackily over the top to be believable?</p>
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		<title>By: Mark Butler</title>
		<link>http://timesandseasons.org/index.php/2006/05/expecting-kangaroo-fur/#comment-183733</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark Butler</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 May 2006 22:49:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.timesandseasons.org/?p=3178#comment-183733</guid>
		<description>So far as we know the &quot;Strengthening the Members&quot; Committee is little more than a clipping service that collects particularly eyebrow raising published articles and speeches and forwards them on to local leadership for further consideration, counselling, and possible church discipline.

Mostly stuff like arguing the Book of Mormon is a fabrication, that the Priesthood is a conspiracy for hegemonic domination of the innocent, and so on.  There is a broad range of perspectives on what should legitimately constitute apostasy, but when one actively portrays and promotes an attitude more hostile to the Church than the average view on the outside looking in, the line has probably been crossed.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So far as we know the &#8220;Strengthening the Members&#8221; Committee is little more than a clipping service that collects particularly eyebrow raising published articles and speeches and forwards them on to local leadership for further consideration, counselling, and possible church discipline.</p>
<p>Mostly stuff like arguing the Book of Mormon is a fabrication, that the Priesthood is a conspiracy for hegemonic domination of the innocent, and so on.  There is a broad range of perspectives on what should legitimately constitute apostasy, but when one actively portrays and promotes an attitude more hostile to the Church than the average view on the outside looking in, the line has probably been crossed.</p>
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		<title>By: Rosalynde Welch</title>
		<link>http://timesandseasons.org/index.php/2006/05/expecting-kangaroo-fur/#comment-183712</link>
		<dc:creator>Rosalynde Welch</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 May 2006 21:55:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.timesandseasons.org/?p=3178#comment-183712</guid>
		<description>Jim (#16): &quot;Gene and Hugh Nibley were great men, but kings? I donâ€™t think so. &quot;

No, Jim, you&#039;re exactly right, and I didn&#039;t mean to suggest that either so aspired or attained. Gene was noble but not regal; Hugh Nibley I never knew. (What I meant was that their names were familiar to my childish ears, but also Important and Remote and Elevated, in the same way that &quot;king&quot; sounded.)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jim (#16): &#8220;Gene and Hugh Nibley were great men, but kings? I donâ€™t think so. &#8221;</p>
<p>No, Jim, you&#8217;re exactly right, and I didn&#8217;t mean to suggest that either so aspired or attained. Gene was noble but not regal; Hugh Nibley I never knew. (What I meant was that their names were familiar to my childish ears, but also Important and Remote and Elevated, in the same way that &#8220;king&#8221; sounded.)</p>
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		<title>By: Kimball L. Hunt</title>
		<link>http://timesandseasons.org/index.php/2006/05/expecting-kangaroo-fur/#comment-183675</link>
		<dc:creator>Kimball L. Hunt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 May 2006 20:13:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.timesandseasons.org/?p=3178#comment-183675</guid>
		<description>Oh and whereas Martha, for whatever reason?, NEGLECTS to mention anything at all about the incident involving the neighborhood boy in her book, oddly enough --</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh and whereas Martha, for whatever reason?, NEGLECTS to mention anything at all about the incident involving the neighborhood boy in her book, oddly enough &#8211;</p>
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		<title>By: APJ</title>
		<link>http://timesandseasons.org/index.php/2006/05/expecting-kangaroo-fur/#comment-183674</link>
		<dc:creator>APJ</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 May 2006 20:12:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.timesandseasons.org/?p=3178#comment-183674</guid>
		<description>haha...so, Ms. Beck then, would be Dan Brown-likein her controversy-causing.  anyways, i think &#039;Mormon Opus Dei&#039; is a funny name for the Strengthening Committee, and will use it until the Committee comes &#039;out of the shadows&#039; and explains why it is not like Opus Dei.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>haha&#8230;so, Ms. Beck then, would be Dan Brown-likein her controversy-causing.  anyways, i think &#8216;Mormon Opus Dei&#8217; is a funny name for the Strengthening Committee, and will use it until the Committee comes &#8216;out of the shadows&#8217; and explains why it is not like Opus Dei.</p>
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