Heder-day Night Live

October 9, 2005 | 74 comments
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Last night Jon Heder, star of Napoleon Dynamite, hosted “Saturday Night Live.” I caught a few of the sketches he played in, and one thing was pretty clear: the kid’s no Philip Seymor Hoffman. He’s amiable and sweet-faced, to be sure, but there’s a muddiness to his voice he can’t seem to clear, and his mouth, for all its soft pliability, is suprisingly unagile with dialogue. I haven’t seen his latest effort, a supporting role in the romantic comedy Just Like Heaven, but in my judgment he doesn’t have either the chops or the charisma to make a career of movie-acting. It’s too bad, because he seems like a genuinely good kid, and Napoleon earned him a ton of celebrity-capital among an important demographic; he might have been the really big, genuinely Mormon star we haven’t had yet. I just hope the boy has managed to keep clean in Hollywood and New York; those are pretty muddy straits for a squeaky-clean BYU boy.

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74 Responses to Heder-day Night Live

  1. NFlanders on October 9, 2005 at 10:37 pm

    I watched the whole thing. It was obvious after one skit that the man simply cannot read off of cue cards to save his life. I think performing live with just a week of preparation is very different from movie acting, so I don’t agree that his career will never take off, though he is rather goofy looking.

    I have to say, though, that I find it squicky to be speculating on whether he has maintained himself “clean” in Hollywood. I doubt you’d put up with that kind of speculation about a female Mormon celebrity. Frankly, I couldn’t care less whether Napoleon is worthy of a Temple Recommend.

  2. Paul on October 9, 2005 at 10:51 pm

    I agree. An actor he is not. But,an icon he will always be.

  3. Rosalynde on October 9, 2005 at 10:52 pm

    NF: You’ve used the word “squicky” a few times—maybe even in reference to me—but I have no idea what you mean by it, except that I’m pretty sure it’s not a nice thing. Enlighten me?

    Listen, the status of the man’s temple recommend has absolutely nothing to do with whether or not he can act, whether or not he deserves a Hollywood career, whether or not I should see his films or join his fan club—and I reject pretty much out of hand any suggestion that it does. But it does, I believe, have a lot to do with his personal happiness, the future of his marriage and family, and, of course, the future of his soul—so yeah, for those reasons I hope he’s doing okay. For the record, I do not invite speculation or gossip on his personal life, nor did I suggest anything like that myself. I just wish the man the best, that’s all.

  4. Jason P. on October 10, 2005 at 12:31 am

    I believe the man to be a great actor in his own respect. He could essentially be the next John Cusack because of his ability to get a cult following and branch out from there. Any young actore is looking for the first initial success that John had in Napolean Dynamite because of the movie sheer underground following. Yes, it does pigeon-hole the guy for any future parts that might ask him to step out of the goofy character because everyone still sees him as the unsure, geeky Napolean. But, really all it takes is just one part that will disconnect society’s internal typecasting…star role in Gladiator 2?

  5. Karen on October 10, 2005 at 1:41 am

    SNL was very very clean last night. And very very unfunny. Coincidence or inevitable conclusion…

  6. NFlanders on October 10, 2005 at 2:08 am

    Sadly, I cannot claim to be in the vanguard of new slang usage; a quick Google search returns 26,000 results for “squicky.” I’ve most often heard it used to describe being creeped out. Most likely it is a portmanteau of “squeamish” and “icky.”

  7. Kurt on October 10, 2005 at 6:31 am

    Term as defined by tweens (purveryors of pop culture): squicky

  8. Davis Bell on October 10, 2005 at 8:54 am

    I saw it, too. Not that funny, but SNL generally isn’t.

    Heder doesn’t seem to have too much natural comedic timing or presence, which isn’t to say that he doesn’t in a context in which he can be more prepared (i.e. movies).

  9. anon on October 10, 2005 at 10:08 am

    Movies in production in which Jon Heder has roles (courtesy of the IMDB):
    Surf’s Up (2007) (announced) (voice)
    Mama’s Boy (2006) (announced)
    School for Scoundrels (2006) (pre-production)
    Monster House (2006) (post-production) …. Skull
    The Benchwarmers (2006) (post-production) …. Clark
    Moving McAllister (2005) (post-production) …. Orlie

    He already has a career in Hollywood. He is an unlikely star, but all the more endearing for it. And if the Hollywood thing doesn’t work out . . . Napoleon II alone (I have no doubt it will eventually be made despite what everybody says about preserving the sanctity of the original) will no doubt make him more money than most of us will ever see in a lifetime.

  10. jjohnsen on October 10, 2005 at 10:35 am

    SNL hasn’t been funny this season(I believe because the best writer, TIna Fey is on maternity leave), but this episode was worse than usual. Heder cannot read cue cards to save his life, and everytime he stumbled over something I wondered if he had rehearsed at all.

    As far as post 0, I’m not even sure what this is doing there.

    “I just hope the boy has managed to keep clean in Hollywood and New York; those are pretty muddy straits for a squeaky-clean BYU boy. ”

    Who cares? I don’t think it’s any of our business, and I also think it’s possible for a Mormon actor to work in NY for a week without becoming a sexual deviant/heroin addict.

  11. Adam Greenwood on October 10, 2005 at 10:51 am

    “Who cares? I don’t think it’s any of our business”

    I think Christ gave a definition of who our neighbor is that would even extend to fellow Mormons. Just suggesting.

  12. Susan M on October 10, 2005 at 11:01 am

    Did anyone see him on Punk’d? The set up was he and his twin, plus I think a friend, all squeaky clean, go to what they think is a restaurant in LA, but it turns out to be brothel, and it gets busted. There was a hot chick kind of coming on to Jon, if I remember right, or maybe she was outright offering her services, but he was looking *really* uncomfortable. The fake cops on that show always manage to make the celebrity do ridiculous things, too, and my memory is horrible, but I could swear they had all three guys holding hands, rather than putting their hands in the air. His twin brother set it up.

  13. a random John on October 10, 2005 at 11:51 am

    I saw the Punk’d. I downloaded it just to see Heder. The segment was completely unfunny, mostly because he didn’t do anything to be embarassed about. He mostly was worried that his brother was acting weird.

    I also saw SNL. Not very impressed. I was much more impressed with him on Conan the night before.

    The funny things that I’ve seen him in are all in character as Napoleon. This includes the Utah State Fair ads and the annual Microsoft spoof found here:
    http://www.ifilm.com/ifilmdetail/2679657?htv=12

    Adam,

    Since all the perma-bloggers here are fellow Mormons, I’d like to know if they all have temple recommends, and if not, why not? Just suggesting.

  14. Rosalynde on October 10, 2005 at 11:59 am

    Hey there, arJ, that’s not fair! I didn’t so much as breathe a word about Heder’s recommend, and I already made it clear that I wasn’t inviting gossip or speculation about his personal life, either. Frankly I’m a little mystified that folks are so upset at my hope that he maintain his religious standards. But let me reiterate: I’m making no prediction or implication about his personal life, nor do I invite such, and my heartiest apologies if I seemed to do so.

    I agree completely, however, that he’s really good and really funny as Napoleon—and that I’ve never seen him do another character very well.

  15. Rosalynde on October 10, 2005 at 12:03 pm

    Davis and anon make good points: live stage-acting chops are not a necessary prerequisite to a successful Hollywood career, and in any case Heder may perhaps already be said to have achieved that sort of career. But to compensate for insufficient skillz over the long term in showbusiness, it seems to me that a star needs to have either serious personal charisma (ie Julia Roberts) or a tabloid-genic personal life (ie Britney Spears). I don’t think Heder has the former, and I hope for his sake he avoids the latter. But may I be proved wrong! Like I said, he seems like an amiable fellow and a positive public figure for kids. I wish him all the best.

  16. Ryan Bell on October 10, 2005 at 12:21 pm

    Rosalynde, how dare you hope he stays out of the tabloids! What are you, his p.r. flack?

  17. Russell Arben Fox on October 10, 2005 at 12:21 pm

    Even a little bit of Napoleon goes a long way. I can’t say I’ve liked any of Heder’s riffs on the character outside the Dynamite context; it just doesn’t work for me if it’s not surrounded by retro-80s Southern Idaho stake dances and tater tots and such.

  18. Adam Greenwood on October 10, 2005 at 12:25 pm

    “Adam,

    Since all the perma-bloggers here are fellow Mormons, I’d like to know if they all have temple recommends, and if not, why not? Just suggesting. ”

    See what Rosalynde said in #14, Mr. John. I think if it turned out that you hoped all the cobloggers here were worthy to go the temple, we wouldn’t hold that against you.

  19. Jed on October 10, 2005 at 12:32 pm

    “I just hope the boy has managed to keep clean in Hollywood and New York; those are pretty muddy straits for a squeaky-clean BYU boy.”

    This is actually an important point, not at all prying into a private life. Heder’s picture appears next to Steven Covey’s in today’s Newsweek in a sidebar showing the diversity of prominent Mormons. Are believing Mormons comfortable with Mormonism being represented by nominal Church members? I would think most of us want the Church to be represented favorably; are we prepared for a lapsed Mormon who takes seedy roles to represent us in the national eye? Rosalynde’s word “clean” probably represents the image believers would like to see cultivated.

  20. Clark on October 10, 2005 at 12:58 pm

    Lapsed Mormon? Are you sure? I thought he was active. In a recent Time magazine article he said he wouldn’t take roles that included sexual themes. Or are you talking about Covey? As far as I knew he was still active as well. I believe his business partner, Hyrum Smith or something like that, was excommunicated for an affair with his secretary about 8 years ago. I’ve no idea if he came back or not. But so far as I know both are active. Now there are quite a few B-list actors who are lapsed Mormons that I wouldn’t want representing the church. But most of them don’t exactly say favorable things about the church in the press.

  21. a random John on October 10, 2005 at 1:02 pm

    Rosalynde,

    I have no trouble with your comments, I was merely poking fun at Adam’s comment in #11. Since these people are my “neighbors” I just want to make sure that they are keeping clean in the muddy straits of the world.

    Adam,

    Honestly, I don’t want to know about your worthiness or that of your co-bloggers. Since I don’t interact with you outside of the text on these pages what you do outside of the blog isn’t that relevant to me. Well, other than this juicy gossip that my wife heard at Costco about Rosalynde…

  22. Jed on October 10, 2005 at 1:09 pm

    “Lapsed Mormon? Are you sure? I thought he was active.”

    Clark, Oh, no, no, no, I am not suggesting that either Heder or Covey is lapsed. I am suggesting the more general point a believer’s desire to see a Mormon remain “clean” is not unreasonable, for cleanliness represents the believing face of Mormonism before the public.

  23. Rebecca on October 10, 2005 at 1:12 pm

    I had mentioned to a friend (not Mormon) that the lead singer from The Killers was Mormon. Her response was, “wow I bet his agent isn’t too excited about that.� Of course the lead singer has admitted that he is Mormon, but not practicing, yet still this is an interesting question for other “famous� Mormons who work in an industry where publicity is important to their career. Seeing that the industry is focused around parties and partying it must be a great deal of work to keep the attention focused on the performer and his/her work and away from the subject of his or her religion and values.

    I watched SNL and thought it was as funny as any other SNL this season. I didn’t think Heder did a terrible job either, but maybe that is because I was busy looking for his garment line and waiting to hear BYU references.

  24. Cyril on October 10, 2005 at 1:21 pm

    I think one point we are all making but not stating is that the genius behind Napoleon was more Hess than Heder.

    I don’t think Heder was bad on SNL. The script was pretty unfunny, and he was mediocre, but that is SNL these days.

  25. Adam Greenwood on October 10, 2005 at 1:30 pm

    “Honestly, I don’t want to know about your worthiness or that of your co-bloggers.”

    Hoping that we’re worthy is not the same as asking. I don’t want to know whether you’re worthy either, but I hope that you are.

  26. DavidH on October 10, 2005 at 1:31 pm

    Clark,

    Re: Steve Covey’s business partner, Deseret Book published a book by Hyrum W. Smith a year or so ago called Pain Is Inevitable, Misery Is Optional, recounting some of BrotherSmith’s experiences and his restoration of blessings vy President Hinckley. Neither the book, nor any other public reliable source that I have seen, mentions what event led to the Church sanction. It is a very good book.

  27. a random John on October 10, 2005 at 1:35 pm

    Rebecca,

    “I watched SNL and thought it was as funny as any other SNL this season.”

    Given that this was the second episode this season that isn’t saying much. :)

    Tina Fey’s absence is really felt. Especially during the news. Horatio Sanz is pretty worthless. And I’m not just saying that because he stole my taxi once in Miami Beach…

  28. a random John on October 10, 2005 at 1:40 pm

    Adam,

    I guess that I hope that you’ll all perfect people, but I really don’t think about that at all. Well, just now because you asked about it, but not at all other than that. Well, except for that thing my wife heard at Costco…

    Maybe we should take a few steps back. Could you explain to me what you meant in your comment #11?

  29. a random John on October 10, 2005 at 1:41 pm

    um, “you’re all” not “you’ll all”. Obviously I’m not a perfect typist, so you already know I’m not a candidate for immediate translation.

  30. Jed on October 10, 2005 at 1:42 pm

    Rebecca,

    I am glad you mentioned the lead singer of The Killers–his face was next to Heder’s and Covey’s in the Newsweek article. (I hadn’t heard of him before seeing him in the article.) The juxtaposition of these faces represents the tensions I was alluding to earlier. Here we have a case of two practicing Mormons–Heder and Covey–being found together with a non-practicing Mormon, The Killer singer. All three are represented as Mormons. What, then, is Mormonism in the public imagination? Is it a “clean” religion?

    I think Mormonism is undergoing the same transition as Judaism was early in the middle twentieth century. The clean-cut missionary image does not match The Killer image any more than an orthodox Jew matches a secular Jew. Yet both are Jewish. In popular imagination, Mormonism seems becoming a kind of cultural or genetic marker in the way Judaism marks a person regardless of affiliation. Belief takes a back seat. History takes on elevated importance.

  31. Kaimi on October 10, 2005 at 1:52 pm

    I read an interview with Brandon Flowers of the Killers, where he said that he tries to keep to Mormon beliefs, but sometimes has a hard time. There’s no shame in that — as far as I know, all of us have a hard time keeping the commendments sometimes. I certainly do. Also, the interviewer asked if he was a former Mormon and he said no way, there’s nothing former about it, he’s a Mormon.

    Other press reports have discussed whether or not he smokes (one story said that he does) and have raised questions about his sexual orientation. (He recently married his girlfriend, however there have long been rumors that he is gay or bisexual).

    Doesn’t sound worse than half the members in my ward. Possible WoW and/or chastity problems. If that makes someone non-Mormon then we’ve got a lot fewer than 12 million members.

  32. Adam Greenwood on October 10, 2005 at 1:53 pm

    In #11 I meant that Rosalynde W.’s hope that he hadn’t succumbed to temptation was laudably Christian.

  33. Cyril on October 10, 2005 at 3:14 pm

    Well said, Kaimi. Flowers has repeatedly maintained that he is a practicing though not perfect Mormon, and I for one think he opens more doors than he closes.

    I also think the analogy to Jews (#30) is fitting but not perfect. As my Jewish friends tell me, give Mormonism a few more hundred years, and we will be lucky if there are only three main fragments.

  34. Mark B. on October 10, 2005 at 3:47 pm

    There seem to be many on here today ready to make Rosalynde an offender for a word. You should all go out and join your local Columbus Day parade, get some fresh air, chill.

  35. David H. Sundwall on October 10, 2005 at 4:26 pm

    Take this strange anecdote for what its worth, but here in DC, Fred Grandy (“Gopher” of the Love Boat, former Iowa congressman) co-hosts a morning radio show and mentioned that his son is a writer for SNL. His son had told him that Heder had nixed several skits “beacuse he was a Mormon.”

    I didn’t see it so I can’t comment if the skits seemed cleaner than usual or less funny. I haven’t watched it for some time.

  36. John Kane on October 10, 2005 at 4:33 pm

    SNL hasn’t been funny in years, Heder or no Heder, Fey or no Fey.

  37. jjohnsen on October 10, 2005 at 10:38 pm

    “Take this strange anecdote for what its worth, but here in DC, Fred Grandy (“Gopher” of the Love Boat, former Iowa congressman) co-hosts a morning radio show and mentioned that his son is a writer for SNL. His son had told him that Heder had nixed several skits “beacuse he was a Mormon.” ”

    It didn’t seem cleaner than normal, so I don’t think it was nixed skits that made it less funny. Just a bad week in what has been years of mediocre SNL’s.

    Also, apologies for #10, I was half asleep and probably took the post as something more than it was. It seemed judgemental, but I realize that was on my part. I’ll try to shower and wake up before I post.

    I think I read the same interview as Kaimi about The Killers, in Rolling Stone I think? I didn’t get the impression he was totally active, but it sounded like he was trying.

  38. Mike Parker on October 11, 2005 at 12:36 am

    Considering the SNL hasn’t been really funny since the early 1990′s, telling me that Heder hosted an unfunny SNL is not news.

    R.I.P., Phil Hartman.

  39. Mike Parker on October 11, 2005 at 12:37 am

    Considering that SNL hasn’t been really funny since the early 1990′s, telling me that Heder hosted an unfunny SNL is not news.

    R.I.P., Phil Hartman.

  40. Brian G on October 11, 2005 at 1:37 am

    Much more interesting to me than this post itself is the reaction to it. I think it’s time for Mormons to generally abandon what in my opinion is an irrational and unrealistic need for Mormon celebrities to be squeaky clean. A celebrity in general is put under the microscope to a degree most of us can not fathom, or withstand favorably. Although I know Rosalynde meant no offense in her post, it does contain some ideas that deserve scrutiny.

    First is this notion that we need a “big, genuinely Mormon star.” Why? It would be nice, but isn’t it more important that they’re genuinely talented, and what is meant by genuinely Mormon? Are successful actors like Aaron Eckhart not Mormon enough for everybody, or is he just not a big enough star? It’s the nature of crafts such as acting, directing, writing, and performing music that not everybody will love any celebrity’s work or creative choices, but it is also the nature of minority groups to put crushing expectations on their celebrity representatives that often have the unintended effects of pushing them toward stale and unadventurous career choices, or what is worse, downplaying their backgrounds in the media in an effort to escape any harsh inspection.

    Living and working in the “muddy” waters of Hollywood as I do, I see a lot of aspiring Mormons of all kinds strive to make their way spiritually and professionally. I feel real gratitude toward any Mormon celebrity, no matter how often they do or don’t go to church and no matter how worthy or unworthy they may be, just as long as they are open and honest about their Mormon backgrounds in the press. In the best of circumstances making it as an entertainer is a colossal challenge and the “squeaky clean” reputation is a real barrier if you’re trying to get hired by people who can only see you in the mold cast by Donny and Marie. I am overjoyed when someone, anyone, of any note, mentions that they’re Mormon because it immediately broadens employers visions of what I am capable of doing. I personally have had to point to some of these artists in job interview situations when people peer over my resume after seeing BYU.

    Secondly, as Christian and well-intended as the last sentence of Rosalynde’s post is, it is a bit annoying. It does represent the nearly foregone conclusions common among Mormons that 1) a career in entertainment is much more spiritually corrosive than any other profession and 2) any Mormon successful in show biz is likely to drift away from the church.

    In my experience there is probably a little bit more truth to the first assumption than the second, but no profession that deals in money, power, long hours away from home, and obtaining praise from the world is typically spiritually beneficial, and all those things, especially the money, power, and praise are more readily available to the rank-and-file lawyer, investment banker, doctor, or what have you, than the struggling actor, writer, or musician.

    As far as the second assumption, it’s not really possible to verify whether people drift away from the church and its values before or after they become successful in an entertainment career, nor is it possible to adequately compare such people to their successful counterparts in careers more approved of in Mormon culture. Yet if it was possible I don’t think you could find much of a significant statistical difference. However, what is crystal clear, to me at least, is that the Church and its people in many ways drift away from Mormon celebrities rather than vice versa. Heder may have been bad on SNL, but look how fast we became disappointed in him and pray he hasn’t been corrupted. We’re so quick to wag our fingers when people try to stretch themselves and Mormons as a rule seem nearly incapable of separating an actor from a role, or a writer from a character. Speculation quickly abounds and the drifting process begins.

    When people such as Orson Scott Card and Richard Dutcher are frequently raked over the coals for fairly inoffensive artistic choices I have to ask myself why we treat our artists so poorly. We reward the best of them with half the approval and twice the criticism. The implicit message we often send out to our best, most talented celebrities is you’re not good enough–both not a good enough Mormon, ort a good enough artist. The reason I’m making so much of this is not because I think Rosalynde did anything horrible here (she’s all right in my book and I’m sure she understands I’m just using her words as a springboard to make her thread more substantive), but in my opinion the manner of thinking that Rosalynde’s post typifies encourages young Mormons not to pursue artistic careers and retards the growth of Mormon culture at the same time it limits what our contribution to popular culture can be.

    One more thing…you may not like her, Rosalynde, but Julia Roberts does have acting skillz in addition to her charisma.

  41. Davis Bell on October 11, 2005 at 7:08 am

    Oh, Brian, I’m afraied you’ve been muddied by the waters of Hollywood. Sigh. You say you work on “Dancing With the Stars?” More like “Smoking Pot and Losing Your Testimony With the Stars.”

    Also, I admire Brandon Flowers for owning up in public to his issues. At the very least he’s avoided being a hypocrite. Further, given his profession, I think he gains little and loses more by not disavowing his Mormonism, so props to him. Even if the Killers aren’t that good.

  42. jjohnsen on October 11, 2005 at 8:57 am

    “Even if the Killers aren’t that good. ”

    *gasp*

  43. danithew on October 11, 2005 at 9:59 am

    I thought Heder did a good job in his bit parts of Just Like Heaven. I was disappointed though that there wasn’t a little more of him in the movie.

    I hope he succeeds further into his career. If he did badly in SNL, I blame SNL.

  44. Rosalynde on October 11, 2005 at 11:48 am

    Re #40: Wow, a 1,000 word response to a 100 word post—I’m not sure whether to be flattered or annoyed! Neither, probably, since I don’t think you’re really responding to anything I actually wrote, anyway. I suggest you save your comment, and put it back up when somebody writes a post that in fact makes the assertions to which you object.

  45. a random John on October 11, 2005 at 12:37 pm

    Wow Rosalynde. I think you’d appreciate Brian’s insider view. Obviously more than a few people on this thread have taken your comments in the same way that he did. Perhaps we aren’t skillful enough readers, but it seems to me that he is responding to issues that the tone of your post implied even if they weren’t dicussed in detail by you.

    Perhaps rather than having him save his comment for a post that you think they are more applicable to you could instead invite him to guest post since I think his response was more interesting than anything else in the post or these 44 (now 45?) comments.

  46. Rosalynde on October 11, 2005 at 1:34 pm

    arJ, Brian and his wife Shannon guest-blogged at T&S last year; their posts can be found here

    Brian’s comments are, without question, the most interesting (and substantive) thing on the thread, but they put me in the position of having either to argue assertions I never made or to engage in a point-by-point rebuttal of the sort I find endlessly tiresome in blog debates. But they don’t put you in the same position, so by all means, carry on!

  47. Nate Oman on October 11, 2005 at 3:28 pm

    Brian has very clearly been corrupted by Hollywood…

  48. Steve Evans on October 11, 2005 at 3:41 pm

    uh-oh! Rosalynde is in the awkward position of either defending a hastily-written post, or admitting that the post was hastily written! For once, it is comforting to see her in the same spot as every other member of the blogosphere.

  49. Nate Oman on October 11, 2005 at 3:47 pm

    I think that Steve has been corrupted by Hollywood as well…

  50. Steve Evans on October 11, 2005 at 3:50 pm

    Nate: I am the source of corruption. Or haven’t you been paying attention?

  51. Rosalynde on October 11, 2005 at 4:17 pm

    Steve, if that’s the extent of my awkwardness, I’m pleased to admit that the post was hastily written and, as a result, poorly tuned! Alas, I’m afraid my inexplicably reflexive defensiveness today has gotten me into more trouble on this thread… Well, that and Satan, of course.

  52. Steve Evans on October 11, 2005 at 4:52 pm

    Aha!!

  53. Brian G on October 11, 2005 at 5:38 pm

    Sorry, Rosalynde.

    I felt I made it clear I was taking a leap from what you’d originally said, and that I thought you didn’t say anything objectionable to begin with, but I guess not. I didn’t want you to offer a rebuttal, or defend assertions I admit you didn’t make. In the future I’ll keep any responses to your posts more brief. Maybe even shorter than this.

  54. Adam Greenwood on October 11, 2005 at 5:38 pm

    Longer, please.

  55. Tom J on October 11, 2005 at 11:15 pm

    Thank you Brian G for you understanding and insider view of being a Mormon entertainer.

  56. Miranda PJ on October 12, 2005 at 12:00 am

    Heder is funny in Just Like Heaven, but he’s still playing a Napolean-type character. Don’t be hard on him if he didn’t shine on Saturday Night Live. Years ago, the funniest SNL stars often couldn’t make it in movies. Now, stars who aren’t funny on SNL are talented enough to carry a movie by themselves. The writing has become quite poor in general.

  57. Lame on October 12, 2005 at 10:14 pm

    Lame. You guys are lame.

  58. Shannon Keeley on October 13, 2005 at 12:41 pm

    Well, well, well. I’m back. It’s been a long time.

    It all started at breakfast this morning, when Brian G (yes, the author of the epic #40) was corrupting our daughter with his Lucky Charms, trying to convince her that they were actually Honey Nut Cheerios so he could eat them in front of her without her wanting any. I consider it a minor miracle that I’ve managed to get her used to eating a healthy cereal (Complete Wheat) for breakfast, then Brian has to bust out his Lucky Charms and drag her into his evil world of sugar-laden, nutrition-less cereals, not to mention the fact that this particular cereal offers a poor representation of Irish culture.

    Naturally, I got upset about that whole thing, to which Brain responded: “Why is everyone flipping out on me?!” “You’re flipping out on me, Rosalynde is flipping out on me!”

    So I had to check this thread out and see what all the hooplah was about. As usual, I am on Rosalynde’s side. Brian called her content not only “annoying” but pointed out that it wasn’t “substantive.” As I called this to Brian’s attention I also learned that I do not know how to pronounce “substantive.” It’s a tricky word, really.

    Anyway, Ros, go ahead and give him hell. You know I do. Every day.

    As far as the original post, and Brain’s lengthy response, I really don’t have much insight to offer. I didn’t see the Heder SNL show because we don’t have our TV hooked up (we just moved), but I probably wouldn’t have watched anyway because, as everyone has pointed out, SNL has not been funny in years. The last funny comedian on that show was Chris Farley, in my opinion. When he died, a part of me died too.

    The most annoying thing about Brian’s post is not anything that was expressed, but the fact that he even took the time to write it. If he spent even half as much time revising his latest novel or screenplay as he does blogging, then HE would be the subject of a “Mormon celebrity” blog post rather than Doug Heder. I’ve got nothing against blogging, please don’t misunderstand me. But it is a shame that none of you will ever have the pleasure of enjoying his work because he spends all his time blogging instead of working on his on his novel, which is, in my opinion, completely brilliant.

    Anyway, I didn’t mean to turn Ros’s thread into a public forum for airing our marital woes.

    Now I really realty have to go because Brian just literally banged our daughter’s head into a chandelier and she is screaming her head off.

    It’s been fun reading you all again.

    ~Shannon

  59. Nate Oman on October 13, 2005 at 1:39 pm

    I think that Shannon has also probably been corrupted by Hollywood…

  60. Nate Oman on October 13, 2005 at 1:44 pm

    I think that RW has also been corrupted by Hollywood. Or maybe even a worse den of sin decadence and inquity: St. Louis…

  61. Adam Greenwood on October 13, 2005 at 1:45 pm

    “f he spent even half as much time revising his latest novel or screenplay as he does blogging, then HE would be the subject of a “Mormon celebrity” blog post rather than Doug Heder.
    . . .
    But it is a shame that none of you will ever have the pleasure of enjoying his work because he spends all his time blogging instead of working on his on his novel, which is, in my opinion, completely brilliant”

    Wow, how true is that for 99% of us. Except for the brilliant part.

  62. Adam Greenwood on October 13, 2005 at 1:48 pm

    I’m trying to decide which is worse, sin decadence or inquity? Sin decadence, I think, because that’s much worse then decadence of the regular kind.

  63. Shannon Keeley on October 13, 2005 at 1:51 pm

    Nate: You kissed your dreams of Hollywood stardom goodbye years ago when you failed to show for the Helaman Halls lip sync performance of “Summer Lovin.” You’ll never work in this town!!!
    I just can’t let that go.

  64. Rosalynde on October 13, 2005 at 1:57 pm

    True, Adam, but syn-dicadetedness (which is obviously what Nate was trying to spell) is worst of all. That’s the sort of Hollywood corruption Brian, Shannon and I can only dream of…

  65. Shannon Keeley on October 13, 2005 at 2:02 pm

    Hmmm. . .Nate used to use the phrase “hellish pit of sin and iniquity” and I see now that he has revised to “sin decadence or iniquity.” I guess everyone needs a little variety.

    Adam: On the issue of blogging vs. writing/ working / etc.. . .

    I think that there are times when a post, a thread, etc., can have artistic merit and be like a masterpiece in and off itself. Don’t get me wrong, I do believe that crafting a great post can be worthy of one’s creative time and energy.
    On the other hand, there are times when one is drawn to blogging as an escape from other projects or responsibilities. And of course, there is an opportunity cost with everything we choose to spend our time on. Taking this into consideration, I often feel that one can waste quite a bit of time funneling creative energy into blogging while other projects are neglected. . .

    And to Rosaynde: I really need to apologize for thread-jacking this thread (although Brian did a pretty good job of that on his own, eh?). Sorry. This is clearly a discussion for another thread / time / blog / universe / etc. Pretend I never commented.

  66. Nate Oman on October 13, 2005 at 2:06 pm

    Shannon: Suffice it to say that I am still suffering from the career-destroying mistake of bailing on summer lovin’ One of the many regrets I carry around from my youthful cowardice.

  67. Rosalynde on October 13, 2005 at 2:08 pm

    Not to worry, Shannon, anything to get the attention off my own bad behavior upstream!

    And I don’t know what the rest of you are talking about: I for one have put ALL my eggs in the blogbasket as my ticket to fame, fortune, and a minivan. I expect to hear from an agent any day now.

  68. Shannon Keeley on October 13, 2005 at 2:15 pm

    Rosalynde:
    Not true! What about your piece “Red Moon and Metaphor” in the latest Exponent Issue? (Are you going to kill me for mentioning it?) You ARE still writing outside of blogging.

    And don’t forget that academic paper about reality TV that you need to ghost write for Brian. At that rate he’s going, that thing will never get written and he’s already been accepted to the conference. . .

  69. Brian G on October 13, 2005 at 5:38 pm

    RE: #58. I just want to say in my own defense that it was a very low-hanging chandelier. No stiches. No foul.

    No more shoulder rides inside the house though, but I’m serious the chandelier was really low–I’m not even very tall.

  70. CS Eric on October 13, 2005 at 6:32 pm

    This is in defense of Jon Heder. He attends Church at the same building as my brother (not sure if it is the same ward or not), and is active–as active as you can be when you travel as much as he does with his new-found stardom. My sister-in-law used to babysit him.

    My nephews laugh every time they see a poster of him. Can’t believe somebody they know deserves the fame. They all really love tater tots now….

  71. Casey on October 13, 2005 at 9:43 pm

    The Black Eyed Peas sketch was the best of the night and Heder was funny.

  72. Jeremy on October 13, 2005 at 10:06 pm

    Am I the only person in the world that thinks SNL is still funny? Sure, Tina Fay is missed sorely on weekend update, and a few of the skits during Heder’s appearance were clumsy, but there are still some bright spots. Doesn’t anyone else find the Rick and Kaitlin characters quite funny (Rick! Rick!), and am I alone in detecting an odd and endearing tenderness in Rick’s patience towards his hyperactive, lisping step-daughter? And is it just nostalgia for Tito Puente that makes Ferecito funny. And it can’t just by my political leanings that make me laugh at whatsisface’s impersonations of Dubya.

  73. Justin H on October 13, 2005 at 11:36 pm

    Jeremy, I’m with you.

    Of course, I miss the late ’80s, early ’90s when I really started watching, but the Falconer puts me in stitches–actually, almost anything involving Will Forte. Seth Meyers is good, and Rachel Dratch kills me. Maya Rudolph and Fred Armisen as Núni and Nüni are also always good for a laugh (and Armisen as Ferecito). I love when Darrell Hammond shows up.

    I miss Tina Fey, and Ana Gasteyer.

  74. batboy on March 18, 2006 at 7:57 pm

    Brian isn’t a star and can’t dance, Nate should of never left Groundlings and Shannon is usually always right. Word.